I am looking for a dog and I was thinking in a schnauzer (mini or
standard) any advice? Breeders in Toronto?

Thx

Paulo

"Paulo" wrote in message
...
I am looking for a dog and I was thinking in a schnauzer (mini or
standard) any advice? Breeders in Toronto?

Miniature and standard schnauzers are very different dogs. They have very
different temperaments and even different builds. It's very much NOT just a
matter of size difference.

There are some very good breeders in your area but you need to have an idea
which dog you are particularly interested in. I do know someone in your
general area.

What sort of dog are you thinking would fit in your life - what are you
planning to do with the dog?

~~Judy

Judy wrote:
"Paulo" wrote in message
...

I am looking for a dog and I was thinking in a schnauzer (mini or
standard) any advice? Breeders in Toronto?


Miniature and standard schnauzers are very different dogs. They have very
different temperaments and even different builds. It's very much NOT just a
matter of size difference.

There are some very good breeders in your area but you need to have an idea
which dog you are particularly interested in. I do know someone in your
general area.

What sort of dog are you thinking would fit in your life - what are you
planning to do with the dog?

~~Judy




Well, I am not planning "to do" anything with the dog. I have to find a
dog that can feel comfortable in an apartment, I have an small backyard
as well. I was already reading a lot about miniature schnauzer,
according to what i read they can fit an apartment lifestyle. I want an
acitve bird and social. Most of the small dog are quite "temperamental".
Some people recommend me this breed, but I would like to know the "cons"
as well the "pros". How different are miniature to standard?

Paulo

On Sun, 26 Dec 2004 23:38:16 -0500, Paulo
wrote:

Judy wrote:
"Paulo" wrote in message
...

I am looking for a dog and I was thinking in a schnauzer (mini or
standard) any advice? Breeders in Toronto?


Miniature and standard schnauzers are very different dogs. They have very
different temperaments and even different builds. It's very much NOT just a
matter of size difference.

There are some very good breeders in your area but you need to have an idea
which dog you are particularly interested in. I do know someone in your
general area.

What sort of dog are you thinking would fit in your life - what are you
planning to do with the dog?

~~Judy




Well, I am not planning "to do" anything with the dog. I have to find a
dog that can feel comfortable in an apartment, I have an small backyard
as well. I was already reading a lot about miniature schnauzer,
according to what i read they can fit an apartment lifestyle. I want an
acitve bird and social. Most of the small dog are quite "temperamental".
Some people recommend me this breed, but I would like to know the "cons"
as well the "pros". How different are miniature to standard?

Paulo

I'm not an expert on the breed, but I grew up with a miniature
schnauzer. We had her for 13 years. They are good little watch dogs
and strong for their size, as opposed to the more fragile breeds.
They are also good with children. One drawback, in my opinion, is
their need for grooming. It's not necessary, but the schnauzer "look"
is hair clipped short leaving their beard and legs long-haired.
Grooming must be done every 6 weeks to maintain the look. Also, if
you live in a snowy area, the long hair on their legs and beard can
get matted with snow, which will melt fast, but weigh the dog down. I
didn't understand what you said about birds, but the schnauzer we had
brought home quail she caught once in awhile. We tried to discourage
that behavior, though. She also liked to chew on rocks and died
toothless because of it, but I'm sure that was unique only to her
particular personality.
pepsi

"Paulo" wrote in message
...
Well, I am not planning "to do" anything with the dog. I have to find a
dog that can feel comfortable in an apartment, I have an small backyard

Okay, so what you were planning to do with the dog is play, pet and take
walks and naps on the couch. Miniature schnauzers can do all that very
well.

To understand the primary difference between standard and miniatures you
should first consider the background of the breed. Miniatures were bred to
be ratters and family pets. Standards were bred to be working dogs. Pull
carts, herd livestock, guard the property. A miniature may raise an alarm
if someone enters the home area. A standard is much more likely to take
matters into his own paws and detain the intruder until his presence is
approved. A miniature schnauzer - of proper size and weight will be well
under 20 pounds. A standard schnauzer will be over 40 pounds.

I have two miniatures - both from the same breeder, who lives in Buffalo.
She does a lot of showing up in Toronto and has many contacts there. (And
sells many dogs to Canada.) If you would like, I will e-mail you her
contact information and you can talk with her. She could be extremely
helpful to you. (She also has experience with standards in case you really
do want to consider that.)

My miniatures do compete in agility and earthdog. My previous schnauzer was
strictly a pet - and he was extremely good at it. Although I am in the US,
one of my dogs was shown to her Canadian championship by the breeder before
retiring and joining her brother at our house. Out of the five dogs in
their litter, one is still at the breeder's and is a show champion, my two
are competing in performance and the other two are entirely pets.

Unless you are experienced at dog training - and I mean more than house
manners - I would not suggest a standard schnauzer. And, no offense to you,
you would probably have difficulty finding a really responsible breeder to
sell you a dog. They are very protective about the homes for their dogs.
Standards are working dogs and require a firm hand or they can make everyone
very unhappy.

Some people recommend me this breed, but I would like to know the "cons"
as well the "pros".

I absolutely love miniature schnauzers. I think they are the perfect,
all-encompassing breed. They are small enough to travel with and share the
bed. Adaptable. They have extremely engaging personalities and are very
interactive with their people. (While I don't like yappy dogs, I do like
dogs that talk to me.) They are also tough little dogs physically. There
is a *dog* there. Smart. I like a dog with a brain.

Yes, they do require regular grooming. But they are as close to truly
non-shedding as they can get. I'm willing to make that trade-off. And I
have found that every schnauzer owner I know has difficulty even considering
another dog in their family if it means dealing with dog hair again. For
instance, as much as I love beagles and labs, I just know I can't ever do
that again now.

They are extremely family and people oriented. This is not a dog to leave
home alone for long periods of time. Yes, it is possible to work and own a
schnauzer - obviously many people do. But they are *very*connected to their
people and that connection is *very* important to them. They thrive with as
much contact with people as possible. They can vary from extremely outgoing
to somewhat reserved around non-family. Not shy, just self-contained in
their own family unit. While they are classified as terriers in the US, it
is more because of their purpose than a true terrier temperament. I find
them much "easier" than many terriers. That may just be me.

For temperament, it all comes back to the breeder. You need a breeder who
breeds first for health and second for temperament. Everything else comes
after that. A responsible schnauzer breeder can have a great deal of
expense in doing all the proper health testing - not only on the puppy but
as far back on the parents and the breeding stock as possible. Schnauzers
are basically a healthy breed but there are a couple of issues that a
breeder needs to address (and a good breeder *will*). Temperament can
vary - although I have honestly seen very few "nasty" miniatures. And those
I suspect were from lack of exposure, not the underlying temperament. But
you want a breeder who does everything possible to avoid problems.

It's not difficult to find a miniature schnauzer. I'm guessing there are
many advertised in the paper and in pet stores in your area. It *is* more
difficult to find a responsible breeder. But they do exist. And they are
not selling dogs in the paper or the pet stores.

How different are miniature to standard?

Almost as different as a poodle is from a German Shepherd.

Let me know if you want that contact information and I'll e-mail it to you.

~~Judy

wrote:
On Sun, 26 Dec 2004 23:38:16 -0500, Paulo
wrote:


Judy wrote:

"Paulo" wrote in message
. ..


I am looking for a dog and I was thinking in a schnauzer (mini or
standard) any advice? Breeders in Toronto?


Miniature and standard schnauzers are very different dogs. They have very
different temperaments and even different builds. It's very much NOT just a
matter of size difference.

There are some very good breeders in your area but you need to have an idea
which dog you are particularly interested in. I do know someone in your
general area.

What sort of dog are you thinking would fit in your life - what are you
planning to do with the dog?

~~Judy





Well, I am not planning "to do" anything with the dog. I have to find a
dog that can feel comfortable in an apartment, I have an small backyard
as well. I was already reading a lot about miniature schnauzer,
according to what i read they can fit an apartment lifestyle. I want an
acitve bird and social. Most of the small dog are quite "temperamental".
Some people recommend me this breed, but I would like to know the "cons"
as well the "pros". How different are miniature to standard?

Paulo


I'm not an expert on the breed, but I grew up with a miniature
schnauzer. We had her for 13 years. They are good little watch dogs
and strong for their size, as opposed to the more fragile breeds.
They are also good with children. One drawback, in my opinion, is
their need for grooming. It's not necessary, but the schnauzer "look"
is hair clipped short leaving their beard and legs long-haired.
Grooming must be done every 6 weeks to maintain the look. Also, if
you live in a snowy area, the long hair on their legs and beard can
get matted with snow, which will melt fast, but weigh the dog down. I
didn't understand what you said about birds, but the schnauzer we had
brought home quail she caught once in awhile. We tried to discourage
that behavior, though. She also liked to chew on rocks and died
toothless because of it, but I'm sure that was unique only to her
particular personality.
pepsi
Thanks Pepsi...I meant dog not bird....i have birds but that another
thing...hehehe
Paulo

Judy wrote:
"Paulo" wrote in message
...

Well, I am not planning "to do" anything with the dog. I have to find a
dog that can feel comfortable in an apartment, I have an small backyard


Okay, so what you were planning to do with the dog is play, pet and take
walks and naps on the couch. Miniature schnauzers can do all that very
well.

To understand the primary difference between standard and miniatures you
should first consider the background of the breed. Miniatures were bred to
be ratters and family pets. Standards were bred to be working dogs. Pull
carts, herd livestock, guard the property. A miniature may raise an alarm
if someone enters the home area. A standard is much more likely to take
matters into his own paws and detain the intruder until his presence is
approved. A miniature schnauzer - of proper size and weight will be well
under 20 pounds. A standard schnauzer will be over 40 pounds.

I have two miniatures - both from the same breeder, who lives in Buffalo.
She does a lot of showing up in Toronto and has many contacts there. (And
sells many dogs to Canada.) If you would like, I will e-mail you her
contact information and you can talk with her. She could be extremely
helpful to you. (She also has experience with standards in case you really
do want to consider that.)

My miniatures do compete in agility and earthdog. My previous schnauzer was
strictly a pet - and he was extremely good at it. Although I am in the US,
one of my dogs was shown to her Canadian championship by the breeder before
retiring and joining her brother at our house. Out of the five dogs in
their litter, one is still at the breeder's and is a show champion, my two
are competing in performance and the other two are entirely pets.

Unless you are experienced at dog training - and I mean more than house
manners - I would not suggest a standard schnauzer. And, no offense to you,
you would probably have difficulty finding a really responsible breeder to
sell you a dog. They are very protective about the homes for their dogs.
Standards are working dogs and require a firm hand or they can make everyone
very unhappy.


Some people recommend me this breed, but I would like to know the "cons"
as well the "pros".


I absolutely love miniature schnauzers. I think they are the perfect,
all-encompassing breed. They are small enough to travel with and share the
bed. Adaptable. They have extremely engaging personalities and are very
interactive with their people. (While I don't like yappy dogs, I do like
dogs that talk to me.) They are also tough little dogs physically. There
is a *dog* there. Smart. I like a dog with a brain.

Yes, they do require regular grooming. But they are as close to truly
non-shedding as they can get. I'm willing to make that trade-off. And I
have found that every schnauzer owner I know has difficulty even considering
another dog in their family if it means dealing with dog hair again. For
instance, as much as I love beagles and labs, I just know I can't ever do
that again now.

They are extremely family and people oriented. This is not a dog to leave
home alone for long periods of time. Yes, it is possible to work and own a
schnauzer - obviously many people do. But they are *very*connected to their
people and that connection is *very* important to them. They thrive with as
much contact with people as possible. They can vary from extremely outgoing
to somewhat reserved around non-family. Not shy, just self-contained in
their own family unit. While they are classified as terriers in the US, it
is more because of their purpose than a true terrier temperament. I find
them much "easier" than many terriers. That may just be me.

For temperament, it all comes back to the breeder. You need a breeder who
breeds first for health and second for temperament. Everything else comes
after that. A responsible schnauzer breeder can have a great deal of
expense in doing all the proper health testing - not only on the puppy but
as far back on the parents and the breeding stock as possible. Schnauzers
are basically a healthy breed but there are a couple of issues that a
breeder needs to address (and a good breeder *will*). Temperament can
vary - although I have honestly seen very few "nasty" miniatures. And those
I suspect were from lack of exposure, not the underlying temperament. But
you want a breeder who does everything possible to avoid problems.

It's not difficult to find a miniature schnauzer. I'm guessing there are
many advertised in the paper and in pet stores in your area. It *is* more
difficult to find a responsible breeder. But they do exist. And they are
not selling dogs in the paper or the pet stores.


How different are miniature to standard?


Almost as different as a poodle is from a German Shepherd.

Let me know if you want that contact information and I'll e-mail it to you.

~~Judy



Thanks a lot Judy.
My experience was with a German Sheppard, very smart dog, very
protective but not agressive at all, excellent around kids and other
pets. Also i had a spanish breton (not sure about the name) too
energetic but nice dog, more into the "all day play" dog.
I know the hair issue with a german sheppard, and I have a cat...i guess
i have enough!!!
I am looking for a dog that can be happy in an apartment but also who
like to play, not scare not nappy, good with people around.
I would really appreciate if you can contact me with your friend.
I am in no rush, i have to deal with other things before, but i want to
have information and some reliable contacts
My email is:

Paulo

Paulo wrote:

I am looking for a dog that can be happy in an apartment but also who
like to play, not scare not nappy, good with people around.

The only thing I'd add to Judy's excellent post is that the Miniature
Schnauzers I've met have been yappy little monsters with a Napoleonic
Complex. Comes from being owned by people who were mollycoddling the
little beasts, IMO.

Suja

"Suja" wrote in message
news:CnYzd.3462$Tf5.2446@lakeread03...
the Miniature
Schnauzers I've met have been yappy little monsters with a Napoleonic
Complex. Comes from being owned by people who were mollycoddling the
little beasts, IMO.

Exactly why. I talk so often with people who see mine (who are far from
perfect but I at least TRY) and say their schnauzers could *never* be that
non-yappy. From what I can tell, the dog behaves exactly like they expect
it to and it has never occurred to them that he could be trained to quiet.
They may even think it's cute. *I* don't want to be around their spoiled
brats either.

They do tend to be independent and many are quite content to be only dogs.
So it's not unusual for them to lose their dog social skills. And since
they do not consider themselves little dogs, Napolean is probably an apt
comparison.

~~Judy

"Paulo" wrote in message
.. .
Judy wrote:
My experience was with a German Sheppard, very smart dog, very
protective but not agressive at all, excellent around kids and other
pets. Also i had a spanish breton (not sure about the name) too
energetic but nice dog, more into the "all day play" dog.

A miniature schnauzer is a very different dog from either of those. I do
like smart dogs - love the brain and the trainability of the shepherds.
Miniatures are more an alarm dog than protective. Most will adapt their
play and exercise needs to you. I knew one who would retrieve a ball as
long as you would throw it. Others look at you like "you threw it, YOU go
get it". (But they may play in other ways.)

I'd suggest, since a miniature schnauzer would be so very different, that
you find a way to spend some time with one, or several. There are many dog
shows during the winter months in the Toronto area. The breeders at those
shows would be very happy to talk with you and let you spend some time with
their dogs. (Just so it's not just before they go into the ring.) Check
the Candian Kennel Club website for a calendar of events.

I would really appreciate if you can contact me with your friend.
I am in no rush, i have to deal with other things before, but i want to
have information and some reliable contacts

I'm sending you the information in just a few minutes. If you don't get it,
let me know.

~~Judy