Hi all,

I've been following this newsgroup and have read all I can about
"responsible breeders." However, on another board there is a discussion
about a pet store called The Urban Puppy. As far as I can tell, they offer
health guarantees (2 years), encourage customers return their dog if they
can't take care of them (for any reason), the owner swears that he doesn't
get the puppies from a puppy mill (vets check out the breeders), and he says
that vets constantly check the puppies in the store.

My gut still says I wouldn't buy from the store (mostly housetraining
problems and I'd rather buy from the breeder who has an intimate knowledge
of each puppy). However, I'm not really sure how to interpret this store.
Is this one of the rare *good* pet stores, or?

Here's the link to the discussion:
http://www.discovervancouver.com/for...TOPIC_ID=67602

Here's the link to the store's webpage:

http://www.theurbanpuppyshop.com/


Any comments would be appreciated!


Tara (and Bacchus)


P.S. I'm quite happy with our Pointer, so not actually looking to buy.

P.P.S. He, who shall not be named, has been blocked.

"T. Stewart" wrote in message
news:Wh9Hg.448086$Mn5.416910@pd7tw3no...
Hi all,

I've been following this newsgroup and have read all I can about
"responsible breeders." However, on another board there is a discussion
about a pet store called The Urban Puppy. As far as I can tell, they
offer
health guarantees (2 years), encourage customers return their dog if they
can't take care of them (for any reason), the owner swears that he doesn't
get the puppies from a puppy mill (vets check out the breeders), and he
says
that vets constantly check the puppies in the store.

My gut still says I wouldn't buy from the store (mostly housetraining
problems and I'd rather buy from the breeder who has an intimate knowledge
of each puppy). However, I'm not really sure how to interpret this store.
Is this one of the rare *good* pet stores, or?

Here's the link to the discussion:
http://www.discovervancouver.com/for...TOPIC_ID=67602

Here's the link to the store's webpage:

http://www.theurbanpuppyshop.com/


Any comments would be appreciated!

Nope, there really is no such thing as Santa Claus, or a good pet store that
sells puppies. There are good stores that offer adoption days to rescue
groups, but any store that buys puppies to resell, or has breeders place
their puppies in the store, is a bad idea and a bad place to obtain a pet.
Now, disregarding the fact that they sell trendy "designer dogs" aka mixed
breeds, let's consider why a pet store, even one with "guarantees" and "no
puppy mill puppies" is always, always, always disreputable. No responsible
breeder - not one - will ever place a puppy through a pet store. Laws
require that pet stores sell to anyone who is willing to buy (and though I
don't know specifics of Canadian law, I would assume they are the same
there) and that means that absolutely no screening or home checks are
allowed. Since no responsible breeder would place a puppy in this manner,
that means that every puppy is obtained from an irresponsible breeder. It's
just plain logic. So now, since every puppy is irresponsibly bred and
placed, it would equate that a pet store, no matter the guarantees, is a
poor choice to obtain a puppy.
As for the guarantees, a 1 year guarantee is worthless against genetic
issues, since most of the common ones reveal themselves later. I couldn't
find specifics but I would imagine the guarantee requires the puppy to be
returned. Since most dog owners will not willingly give up their companion
in order to fulfill the guarantee, it's pretty safe to offer that type and
know they never have to live up to it. And the "no puppy mills" stuff is
crap. Sure, you can say you don't buy from mills - after all, a "USDA
licensed commercial breeder" isn't a puppy mill. Unless, of course, your
definition is different from theirs... and it generally is.
So no, you haven't found the needle in the haystack. Just another load of
hay.

Christy

On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 03:45:58 GMT T. Stewart whittled these words:
Hi all,

I've been following this newsgroup and have read all I can about
"responsible breeders." However, on another board there is a discussion
about a pet store called The Urban Puppy. As far as I can tell, they offer
health guarantees (2 years),

That is a bare minimum. Some very bad pet shops offer that. It is
nothing to brag about.

encourage customers return their dog if they
can't take care of them (for any reason),

Do they contact their customers on a regular basis to see how things are
going, and head off trouble? Responsible breeders to.

the owner swears that he doesn't
get the puppies from a puppy mill (vets check out the breeders),

That depends on your definition of puppy mill. Puppies for profit is my
definition of a mill. Breeders who are not breeding for profit don't need
or want third party sales. Most breed club code of ethics prohibit sales
to pet stores so by definition the puppies are not coming from responsible
breeders. Responsible breeders have as their primary goal breeding
healthier "better" puppies, not creating puppies to market.

and he says
that vets constantly check the puppies in the store.

That's nice. But the point at which puppies are most at risk is when they
are between 6 months and 2 years when they hit adolescence. Responsible
breeders stay in contact to help buyers through the rough spots.

My gut still says I wouldn't buy from the store (mostly housetraining
problems and I'd rather buy from the breeder who has an intimate knowledge
of each puppy). However, I'm not really sure how to interpret this store.
Is this one of the rare *good* pet stores, or?

It might be a better than terrible pet store - but I'd say the chances are
very small that they are doing home checks, that they contact landlords to
make sure the dog really is allowed. I don't see any evidence that they
will provide certificates showing the sire and dam are registered with a
health registery for hip dysplasia, elbow dysplasia, patellar luxation,
CERF screening (eyes), thyroid screening, and cardiac screening. They may
or may not provide 5 generation pedigrees - they don't say.

They SAY many right things. Easy to say them and never do them.

Here's the link to the discussion:
http://www.discovervancouver.com/for...TOPIC_ID=67602
Here's the link to the store's webpage:
http://www.theurbanpuppyshop.com/
Any comments would be appreciated!

I've seen worse, but I'm not impressed. Besides all the support for the
puppy itself is the contribution to the welfare of the breed and of dogs.
Which should include, at minimum, both parents full screened and the
results submitted to an independent health registry. And naturally you
can't track health without tracking a pedigree. A responsible breeder
keeps in touch so they know of problems that develop both health wise and
behavior wise. Responsible breeders will typically require health
clearances even for non-breeding animals - because otherwise how will they
be able to evaluate the outcome of the breeding?


--
Diane Blackman
There is no moral victory in proclaiming to abhor violence
while preaching with violent words.
http://dog-play.com/ http://dogplayshops.com/

On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 03:45:58 GMT, "T. Stewart" ,
clicked their heels and said:


My gut still says I wouldn't buy from the store (mostly housetraining
problems and I'd rather buy from the breeder who has an intimate knowledge
of each puppy). However, I'm not really sure how to interpret this store.
Is this one of the rare *good* pet stores, or?

No such thing, unless they're truly just helping place unwanted
litters (like a shelter). I go by this statement:

"No reponsible breeder sells their puppies through any other source".
Not a "broker", not a "pet store", nothing, nada, zip. They place
with care, evaluation of new owners/home and with support forever.


--
Janet Boss
www.bestfriendsdogobedience.com

wrote in message ...
Do they contact their customers on a regular basis to see how things are
going, and head off trouble? Responsible breeders to.

Responsible
breeders stay in contact to help buyers through the rough spots.

As an example of what you get from a responsible breeder:

Spenser had a little skin infection. Vet put him on an antibiotic. He had
an allergic reaction - intense, crawling itching. At midnight, I called the
vet who suggested the appropriate dose of Benedryl - which I already had in
my hand - with a follow-up dose in the morning and a follow-up vet visit if
it wasn't completely resolved by noon.

At 3 AM, I was on the phone with Spenser's breeder to ask her just how often
I could give him Benedryl. The initial dose helped but had worn off at it
was (obviously) still hours to the second dose suggested by the vet.

At 6 AM, the breeder was calling me to make sure that all was well. She
stayed in e-mail contact for the next couple of days while we started a new
antibiotic (which worked fine).

Spenser is now almost five years old. (How time flies!) Not only has his
breeder been available every single day since his birth, I know she will be
available and interested and involved until the day he dies. Her
accessibility, concern, knowledge of the breed and of his genetic background
and family history are major reasons why we bought from her.

Judy
Spenser - Carbor Talk of the Town, AX, OAJ, NAC. NJC, NGC
Sassy - Can CH Carbor Back Talk, OA, OAJ, NAC, NJC, TN-N