in rec.pets.dogs.behavior, sallytighe wrote in
:

Is it generally acceptable where you live to leave dogs alone inside for
this length of time?

Yup. When Gen goes back to work in September, Moogli will be alone at home
for times that could range from 6 hours to 9 hours, depending on what
after-school activities she has.

--
Marcel Beaudoin and Moogli

Why can't you put him in the crate he sleeps in?
He seems very secure there from your description.

JP

"sallytighe" wrote in message
...


Paul E. Schoen schrieb:

[snip]
When I had to go away for 8-12 hours, I always [snip]


This bit took my breath away, and then I started to wonder if there is a
cultural difference operating here.

Is it generally acceptable where you live to leave dogs alone inside for
this length of time?

Sally

I was very concerned at first when I started leaving him alone in the
house, but only once have I ever had a problem. I think I had just fed him
half a can of dog food with gravy over a bowl of kibble, which he ate
quickly, and then I had to hurry off to work. I had taken him for a short
walk before he ate, but he didn't do very much. I had to work somewhat
later than usual, so it was probably 10-12 hours later that I came home to
find a small pile of poop and a small puddle of pee just inside the door,
and Muttley seemed apologetic. I praised him, and took him out for a much
deserved proper walk, where he really emptied himself (I think he had used
some restraint inside the house), and then I cleaned it up. I didn't use
anything special, just some detergent and bleach, and I'm sure there was
still some remaining odor, but there was never again any problem.

I make sure now that I do not feed him without allowing some time and then
allowing him to go out, but there is usually some kibble in his bowl all
day, and a full water dish. Often times he seems to wait until I come home
before he eats and drinks his fill, and then I take him for his evening
walk.

From what I have learned, this means that Muttley feels secure in his
"den", and is careful not to soil it. Previously, when my cat was still in
the house, I think he eliminated inside as a marking behavior, and also he
did not feel full "ownership" of the house as his den, especially when I
was usually leaving him tethered outside, where he usually did his
business.

Even after he was very reliable in the house, I took him to my other house
next door, which is used for storage, and allowed him to explore while I
looked for something. In that short time, he peed and pooped on the floor.
I pointed to it and told him "No", put him outside, and cleaned it up. He
has not done that again. I didn't make a big deal about it, but just told
him it was not a desired behavior. That seemed to work for him.

But each dog is an individual, and what works for one may not work for
another.

Paul and Muttley

"JP" wrote in message news:Hn5kj.10$NU6.1@trndny01...
Why can't you put him in the crate he sleeps in?
He seems very secure there from your description.

JP

Yes, I am considering that as well., though he is capable of "opening" the
latch with a flip of his nose.

The crate downstairs - site of the "canine crime scene" as quoted by
Muttley's dad, was double bolyrf with lockboxes I used in my real estate
practice.

When he was unable to free himself using his normal method, I think that's
when he literally attacked the cage, ripping bars off like they were
spagetti.

I had a very long chat with my vet last night and she is quite puzzled why
at three this very mellow dog has developed this behavior. He having never
chewed, was easily crate/house trained, and would just as soon snooze on the
couch as do anything. She has advised and prescribed a combination of
behavior modification that includes crate and drugs. The latter to be used
with prudence and carefully monitored by observing his behavior plus
frequent blood panels.

I'm going to begin a 15-30 minute leave and come back with the new crate I
am ordering. With much heavier bars, the possibility of ripping off the
bars and potentially impaling himself is greatly minimized. You see I am
really less concerned about him getting out as I am coming home and finding
him dead from a puncture wound.

And actually around my house the crate during the day is really only
something I need to use when the weather is too bad to put him out. We have
several wooded acres and he enjoys very much hiding in the underbrush and
spying on the house. That, or he like to lay on the pool cover and soak up
the steam.

While he is inside, I am using a combination of pants and belly band to
cover him up well enough that if he does lift to mark he wets himself and
not my couches and beds.

I appreciate everyone's insight and for taking the time to write and share
their opinions and stories.

Kind regards,

(the)duckster

In article aB8kj.45$Ev6.12@trndny07,
"\(the\)duckster" wrote:


Yes, I am considering that as well., though he is capable of "opening" the
latch with a flip of his nose.

Use some leash or carabiner clips to keep it closed.

The crate downstairs - site of the "canine crime scene" as quoted by
Muttley's dad, was double bolyrf with lockboxes I used in my real estate
practice.

Translation?

When he was unable to free himself using his normal method, I think that's
when he literally attacked the cage, ripping bars off like they were
spagetti.

BTDT. Not a good thing.

I'm going to begin a 15-30 minute leave and come back with the new crate I
am ordering. With much heavier bars, the possibility of ripping off the
bars and potentially impaling himself is greatly minimized. You see I am
really less concerned about him getting out as I am coming home and finding
him dead from a puncture wound.

While he is inside, I am using a combination of pants and belly band to
cover him up well enough that if he does lift to mark he wets himself and
not my couches and beds.

Ok, I apparently missed the OP and with my newsreader, don't know how to
go back. How old is this dog/what kind and what is the issue?

--
Janet Boss
www.bestfriendsdogobedience.com

"Janet Boss" wrote in message
...
In article aB8kj.45$Ev6.12@trndny07,
"\(the\)duckster" wrote:


Yes, I am considering that as well., though he is capable of "opening"
the
latch with a flip of his nose.

Use some leash or carabiner clips to keep it closed.

The crate downstairs - site of the "canine crime scene" as quoted by
Muttley's dad, was double bolyrf with lockboxes I used in my real
estate
practice.

Translation?

A lockbox is used for a key when a house is being listed for sale. It
attaches to the doorknob via a combination lock. I removed the lock and
just use the box and latch. Very handy.

When he was unable to free himself using his normal method, I think
that's
when he literally attacked the cage, ripping bars off like they were
spagetti.

BTDT. Not a good thing.

I'm going to begin a 15-30 minute leave and come back with the new crate
I
am ordering. With much heavier bars, the possibility of ripping off the
bars and potentially impaling himself is greatly minimized. You see I
am
really less concerned about him getting out as I am coming home and
finding
him dead from a puncture wound.

While he is inside, I am using a combination of pants and belly band to
cover him up well enough that if he does lift to mark he wets himself
and
not my couches and beds.

Ok, I apparently missed the OP and with my newsreader, don't know how to
go back. How old is this dog/what kind and what is the issue?

Bodie is "just a dog" the son of a stray I picked up a few years back when
she was pregnant. He was born and raised here. He lives with a pack of two
other dogs, plus my granddog - another of the mother's pups, whom I walk
everyday with my three and who frequently visits. All my animals are
neutered/spayed.

About six months ago I guess he began marking, including me a couple of
times. A few times he made a bloody mess in both our bed and my daughter's.
Never could catch him in the act as it was quite intermittent. He also
started to get a bit destructive, though limited to skeins of yarn, bags
fished from trash, toilet paper, things like that.

We began by gradually reducing his privileges, closing off the upstairs,
crating him at night (which he goes to willingly with no complaint, happy to
have his peanut butter bone), and combining the pants and band to control
the marking.

Most of the time when I leave there is either someone else home, or the
weather is nice enough to just put him out, which as I said he quite enjoys.
But there are times when he needs to be inside and since he's not too
trustworthy lately, into the crate he goes.

The last episode is when he went berserk and ripped your standard issue
crate to shreds. Met me at the door with the other two, happy as a clam.
The room was a complete wreck.

Between the marking, shredding, and now the destroying of his crate, I've
decided along with my vet to give the heavy duty cage/drugs/and gradually
extending my time gone to see if we can't modify his behavior.

Additional insight or suggestions are gratefully appreciated. He's really a
very good boy and we love him dearly. If he still had his cojones, I'd
swear it was puberty.

Kind regards,

(the)duckster

--
Janet Boss
www.bestfriendsdogobedience.com

In article NV8kj.15$4b6.1@trndny08,
"\(the\)duckster" wrote:

double bolyrf with lockboxes I used in my real
estate
practice.

Translation?

A lockbox is used for a key when a house is being listed for sale. It
attaches to the doorknob via a combination lock. I removed the lock and
just use the box and latch. Very handy.

I know what a lock box is, I just couldn't figure out what bolyrf is!

Bodie is "just a dog" the son of a stray I picked up a few years back when
she was pregnant. He was born and raised here.

Additional insight or suggestions are gratefully appreciated. He's really a
very good boy and we love him dearly. If he still had his cojones, I'd
swear it was puberty.

I'm a big believer in working and exercising dogs (i.e. a tired dog is a
good dog). Obedience work ALWAYS pays off. I'd either start or go back
and beef it up a lot.

--
Janet Boss
www.bestfriendsdogobedience.com

Paul E. Schoen schrieb:
"sallytighe" wrote in message
...


Paul E. Schoen schrieb:

[snip]

When I had to go away for 8-12 hours, I always [snip]


This bit took my breath away, and then I started to wonder if there is a
cultural difference operating here.

Is it generally acceptable where you live to leave dogs alone inside for
this length of time?

Sally


I was very concerned at first when I started leaving him alone in the
house, but only once have I ever had a problem.snip

Thank you for this and others for the other answers, they certainly
answered my question.

Sally

"Janet Boss" wrote in message
...
In article NV8kj.15$4b6.1@trndny08,
"\(the\)duckster" wrote:

double bolyrf with lockboxes I used in my real
estate
practice.

Translation?

A lockbox is used for a key when a house is being listed for sale. It
attaches to the doorknob via a combination lock. I removed the lock and
just use the box and latch. Very handy.

I know what a lock box is, I just couldn't figure out what bolyrf is!

Oh, beg pardon. I meant in using two he was double bolted in.

Bodie is "just a dog" the son of a stray I picked up a few years back
when
she was pregnant. He was born and raised here.

Additional insight or suggestions are gratefully appreciated. He's
really a
very good boy and we love him dearly. If he still had his cojones, I'd
swear it was puberty.

I'm a big believer in working and exercising dogs (i.e. a tired dog is a
good dog). Obedience work ALWAYS pays off. I'd either start or go back
and beef it up a lot.

We walk a brisk three miles every morning, rain or shine. unless there are
summer thunderstorms, or ice/salt on the road in which case we take to the
fields.

I use a stirrup leather wrapped around my waist and then leash the pack to
that. If you take Bark magazine, it's not unlike Joring, midwesterner
style, though at my age I decline to risk my life by donning skates or skis.

I also have fenced off a half acre of woods and lawn where right now they
are raising hell at the neighbor who is cutting along the tree line in the
back of my property. If he brother were visiting, two would be using the
pool cover as a trampoline or destroying of of their stuffed toys. Sans
exercise, they are not.

But you are quite correct that I have to go back to square one. Something,
somehow, somewhere along the way he's gotten the wrong idea. So I'm
treating him as if he were a puppy again.

Thank you so much for writing and sharing your thoughts.

Kind regards,

(the)duckster

Kimber said in
rec.pets.dogs.behavior:

When I take my dog out of her crate in the morning,
it's been 8 hours, but it's so cold she'd prefer to hold it
even longer, but I make her go out after she's eaten her
kibble.

How old is she? With new dogs and puppies, I like to start
giving freedom at night when I'm semi-supervising.

Anyway, when I was shopping for a
dog, I filled out several applications to animals shelters.
They all pretty much said they wouldn't sell a dog to an
owner that's going to be gone more than 6 hours a day. So
this means only self-employed and retired persons are
allowed to own dogs? I thought that was pretty extreme. So,
when I was filling out the applications and they asked "how
many hours will your dog be alone?" I filled in: "None. The
cat will always be there." They didn't buy it - none of the
shelters contacted me. I ended up buying an adult dog from
a breeder.

When I got Friday from a rescue it was pretty much the same
situation as yours. I had another dog and they'd be alone up
to 10 hours a day. Different adopters have different
criterea, one should "shop" around.

[Please consider using paragraphs in your posts.]



--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.