"Robin Nuttall" wrote:

He's also The Favorite Doberman Sandwich Meat

http://www.totalminpin.net/images/zipper/3couch2.jpg

I so love that picture.

Today he got to go track (CHICKEN!) then off to the Treats Unleashed store
were he got a peanut-butter cup speshull for dogs which he proceeded to
get all over his face, then a cheese and egg brownie. Then supper. He's
looking very fluffy tonight.

As in "I'm not fat, I'm fluffy!"?

"Robin Nuttall" wrote:

Happy Birfday Mr. Zipper!

Holy Cow! Doesn't seem like it's been 3 years already...


Yes, he's got titles. Ch, NA, NAJ, RSN, JSN, UAg1. But his most important
title? Lord of the Laundry.

http://www.totalminpin.net/images/zipper/laundry7mo.jpg

A perfect example of the entertainment value inherent in owning a
terrier.

Incidentally, in that picture he looks like he's exactly the same color as
Cenau; which I'm not sure is what's called "red" or if it's "stag red".

sionnach wrote:

"Robin Nuttall" wrote:
He's
looking very fluffy tonight.


As in "I'm not fat, I'm fluffy!"?


Um, yes. As in, his ration got cut today pretty drastically. He has
agility this weekend and I don't want him lumbering around the course.

sionnach wrote:

Incidentally, in that picture he looks like he's exactly the same color as
Cenau; which I'm not sure is what's called "red" or if it's "stag red".

Red is clear red, which is a solid red with NO black. Black skin on
nose, but dark brown whiskers, etc. It's the same ee masking gene that
results in yellow labs.

Nancy is Clear Red: http://www.totaldobe.com/regatta/images/nancyttwin.jpg


Zipper is stag red (and if I'm remembering the pictures, so is Cenau).
It's red with overlaying black hairs. Genetically sable, AyAy or Ayat.
The latter is sable carrying black and tan, and that's what I'm pretty
sure Zipper is since he has a lot of the black. His brother has produced
black puppies (the one I covet is a wild little thing called The Devil
Wears Prada).

I love the color. It's just so pretty.

Here's a really dark sable, Zipper's granddam:
http://www.totalminpin.net/images/zi...AllAboutMe.jpg

Here's an article I wrote on Min Pin color that explains the sables and
reds:

http://www.totalminpin.net/minpincolor.html

Terri wrote:

Robin Nuttall wrote in
He's looking very fluffy tonight.


Full of himself, eh?


No, rotund. Last night I couldn't find him. I finally looked in his
crate and there he was, stretched out on his back like a little brown
beached whale. Sound asleep. I said his name and he sort of waved all
four feet at me but that was it.

Today his rations were cut.

Robin Nuttall wrote:

He's also The Favorite Doberman Sandwich Meat

http://www.totalminpin.net/images/zipper/3couch2.jpg

That is just too precious! ROFL!

FurPaw

--
The plural of anecdote is not proof.

To reply, unleash the dog.

"Robin Nuttall" wrote:


Zipper is stag red (and if I'm remembering the pictures, so is Cenau).

Cen's definitely stag red, not clear red. He's got black around his mouth
(including a black chin), scattered black hair on his ears; also his ears
are darker than the rest of his body, and he's got a faint dorsal stripe.

It's red with overlaying black hairs.

What had me not quite sure was that the descriptions I read A) didn't make
it clear that it's "red with some black hairs", not "black-tipped red hairs"
and B) just said "red" rather than "clear red".

I love the color. It's just so pretty.

It is a lovely, rich color.... just a wee bit more red than Brenin.
Bren, incidentally, is going amazingly grey/white with the fall coat
change. What was on his muzzle is now up all around his eyes... and his
feet started going white with the spring coat change; I looked at him
yesterday, while we were out walking, and realized that the greying is now
right up his legs.


Here's an article I wrote on Min Pin color that explains the sables and
reds:

Very nicely done! I've saved the .pdf of it for future reference.

Now, what I'm really curious about is how the combination of the Min Pin
stag red masking gene with the JRT piebald gene produced a stag red dog
whose white markings are limited to a white splash on the chest, a white
spot on the end of his sheath, three white toes on the right hind, and two
white toe tips on the left hind.

I don't know that much about JRT color genetics, other than knowing they're
genetically dark dogs - black, brown, or tri-color - with large areas of
color masked by the piebald gene...and a ticking gene tossed into the mix as
well. (Rocsi's base color was similar to Cenau's but a browner shade, and
she had lots of ticking.)
I did have several pages about it bookmarked, but I had a major computer
crash last fall - my motherboard blew up and took my hard drive with it - &
lost them.

sionnach wrote:

Cen's definitely stag red, not clear red. He's got black around his mouth
(including a black chin), scattered black hair on his ears; also his ears
are darker than the rest of his body, and he's got a faint dorsal stripe.

Zip also has a dorsal stripe though it's more of a darker red than
black. You can most clearly see his black hairs on the side of his neck.
One reason I think he's probably Ayat and carrying the gene to throw
black and tan is that he has a very faint saddle:

http://www.totalminpin.net/images/zi...pperchweb1.jpg

Who knows if I'll ever breed him (I'm starting to think I might like to
if I find someone with a nice bitch who wants to use him) but it would
be interesting to see.

Bren, incidentally, is going amazingly grey/white with the fall coat
change. What was on his muzzle is now up all around his eyes... and his
feet started going white with the spring coat change; I looked at him
yesterday, while we were out walking, and realized that the greying is now
right up his legs.

Awwwww. When we went to watch the Missouri State 4H there was a little
girl there with a very old (and very sweet, patient and lovely) Vizsla.
Her face was white and she looked like she had four white socks on.

Very nicely done! I've saved the .pdf of it for future reference.

Now, what I'm really curious about is how the combination of the Min Pin
stag red masking gene with the JRT piebald gene produced a stag red dog
whose white markings are limited to a white splash on the chest, a white
spot on the end of his sheath, three white toes on the right hind, and two
white toe tips on the left hind.

Liisa who sometimes used to hang out in *.breeds is probably your
answer. But I'd say that sable is a dominant. Now why it would allow
enough white to get through for the toes/sheath is an interesting
question. A white splash on the chest is allowed even in Pins (but a
very small bit of white). But it makes sense to me that if Sable is
dominant over black and tan, it would also be dominant over piebald.

"Robin Nuttall" wrote:


Zip also has a dorsal stripe though it's more of a darker red than black.

To clarify - Cenau's dorsal stripe isn't black, it's like Zipper's; a
darker stripe of the base color.

One reason I think he's probably Ayat and carrying the gene to throw
black and tan is that he has a very faint saddle:
http://www.totalminpin.net/images/zi...pperchweb1.jpg

Now that you point it out, I can see it. That picture also nicely shows
the black "mane" on his neck.


Who knows if I'll ever breed him (I'm starting to think I might like to if
I find someone with a nice bitch who wants to use him) but it would be
interesting to see.

Heh. I have to wonder if the effect on his personality might also be
interesting....

Cenau, incidentally, was neutered as an adult; the papers from the shelter
list him as being 2 years, 9 months when it was done (at the time he was
previously adopted in May). He does react a bit to the ladies but in a very
polite way.

Awwwww. When we went to watch the Missouri State 4H there was a little
girl there with a very old (and very sweet, patient and lovely) Vizsla.
Her face was white and she looked like she had four white socks on.

Aww.... reminds me of Max, the Vizsla who was in Bren's first non-beginner
agility class; he greyed like that. As a side note, if I were ever going to
own a pointer-type dog, it would be a Vizsla.
As a not so side note, someone dead seriously asked me a couple of weeks ago
if *Cenau* is a Vizsla!! I was half tempted to say he was a rare miniature
one, but refrained. I've also been asked on a number of occasions if he and
Bren are related.

Liisa who sometimes used to hang out in *.breeds is probably your answer.

I thought of asking on *.breeds but seemed to recall she doesn't post there
any more. ( I read the group occasionally.)

But I'd say that sable is a dominant. Now why it would allow enough white
to get through for the toes/sheath is an interesting question.

Yup.
BTW, the spotting gene also affected the pigmentation of the toenails - on
the left hind, one of the toes has just a few white hairs around the base of
the nail, and that nail is very slightly paler on one side. The toe next to
it has a wee bit more white, and the nail is pink. On the right hind, one of
the three white toes has a black nail, the one next to it has a "harlequin"
nail (black on one side, whitish pink on the other), while the third has
both a pink nail and half-pink toe leather.

A white splash on the chest is allowed even in Pins (but a very small bit
of white).

Cen's is a bit bigger; it's essentially an acute triangle, about 3" high and
2" across the base.

But it makes sense to me that if Sable is dominant over black and tan, it
would also be dominant over piebald.

I found the page on JRT color genetics I used to have - unfortunately, all
the picture links are kaput:
http://russellterrier.org/colorgenetics.html

Jacks carry two of the three piebald/spotting genes, plus modifying genes.
Min Pins must have some sort of spotting gene to get the occasional white
chest patch; perhaps Cenau's got Min Pin spotting with a JRT plus modifier
that gives it more expression??

As a side note, I'm not sure if the sable/"tan" that Jacks have is the same
as the sable you referred to....

"sionnach" wrote:

On the right hind, one of
the three white toes has a black nail, the one next to it has a
"harlequin"
nail (black on one side, whitish pink on the other), while the third has
both a pink nail and half-pink toe leather.

Updating that....

I just noticed - because he's smushed in next to me, sleeping upside down
with his toes in the air - that all three of the toes also have spotting on
the leather; it's essentially one "spot" that stretches across all 3.
Also I forgot to mention that he's also got a smaller white splash on his
throat; it wasn't obvious when I got him because he had an ugly bald spot
there, and all that could be seen of the spash was a few white hairs on the
perimeter. His coat is still a bit thin there.... I suspect the previous
adopters were tying him out on a very tight collar, since the bald spot was
part of a very noticable collar mark all the way around the neck. You can
still see it if you look.

Regarding his former studly status, I've noticed that he still tends to
get.... hrm.... excited fairly often. He also has fairly strong-smelling
pee, which is unfortunately noticeable because the little twerp has a
tendency to pee straight foward & hit his own front legs (he lifts his leg
so high he nearly falls over when he's marking, but if he's just peeing he
stretches out like a male horse). Bleh.