Molly's first introduction to a dog park was a resounding success
(lots of chasing, tussling, no aggression), with 3 other dogs
near her age (6-12 months).

The next two, not so much, and so I'm asking for your advice and
opinions. I haven't been a dog park denizen (lack of
availability, then old dogs with various health issues), so I'm
not sure what to expect and how to deal with what I've seen. And
I wonder if I'm being under- or over-concerned. I don't know
anything about Molly's experience with other dogs prior to June
19. I want the dog park to be a positive experience for her, and
I'm not sure that's happening.

1. Entrance. When we enter, there's an immediate "welcoming
committee" of 2-5 dogs that is a bit overwhelming. Molly becomes
quite submissive (probably ok), alternating with jumping up and
putting her paws on the backs of other dogs (not so smart). All
the dogs seem hyper-excited. What's the best way to enter the
park? Stay in the area between the gates for a few minutes and
let them sniff through the fence and calm down? Walk right in?

2. Introductions. Molly is a bit of a dork here. While the
other dogs are still trying to sniff, she rears up and puts her
paws on their backs, which isn't welcomed. When she's on-leash,
I pop the leash, say "eh!" and pull her off. (Yes? No?) When
she's off leash, she's on her own. Is there a way to train her
to introduce herself more politely, or should I just let the
other dogs take care of that? I'm concerned that she'll do this
to the wrong dog and get attacked.

3. Aggressive dogs. A husky and a mix were determined to tell
her what-for (growling, ears up, tail up) (and of course she just
kept running right back over to them for more and jumping up on
them ???). I tried diverting her (threw a ball, took her over to
another calmer dog), without much success. When they snarled and
bared teeth, she played the puppy card, dropped and rolled on her
back, or tried to lick their muzzles. The husky owner pretty much
ignored it (she has 14 husky rescues at home), and the mix owner
probably was making it worse by keeping her dog on a leash and
jerking her around. Was taking Molly out of the park the best
strategy here?

She's had fun with some of the dogs - she ran a merry chase and
tussle with a 2 year old mix about her size. I think she needs
the dog interaction to learn her own social skills, but maybe
this is too much for her now? How would you proceed?

Opinions?

FurPaw

--
Don't believe everything that you think.

To reply, unleash the dog.

In article ,
FurPaw wrote:


1. Entrance. When we enter, there's an immediate "welcoming
committee" of 2-5 dogs that is a bit overwhelming. Molly becomes
quite submissive (probably ok), alternating with jumping up and
putting her paws on the backs of other dogs (not so smart). All
the dogs seem hyper-excited. What's the best way to enter the
park? Stay in the area between the gates for a few minutes and
let them sniff through the fence and calm down? Walk right in?

I'd wait a few minutes if possible. Of course it would be nice if
owners called their dogs away. have I mentioned how much I generally
disdain dog parks due to the owners?

2. Introductions. Molly is a bit of a dork here. While the
other dogs are still trying to sniff, she rears up and puts her
paws on their backs, which isn't welcomed. When she's on-leash,
I pop the leash, say "eh!" and pull her off. (Yes? No?) When
she's off leash, she's on her own. Is there a way to train her
to introduce herself more politely, or should I just let the
other dogs take care of that? I'm concerned that she'll do this
to the wrong dog and get attacked.


I'd try to give verbal corrections over physical ones. Physical ones
are more likely to increase her feeling vulnerable OR tough IMO.

3. Aggressive dogs. A husky and a mix were determined to tell
her what-for (growling, ears up, tail up) (and of course she just
kept running right back over to them for more and jumping up on
them ???). I tried diverting her (threw a ball, took her over to
another calmer dog), without much success. When they snarled and
bared teeth, she played the puppy card, dropped and rolled on her
back, or tried to lick their muzzles. The husky owner pretty much
ignored it (she has 14 husky rescues at home), and the mix owner
probably was making it worse by keeping her dog on a leash and
jerking her around. Was taking Molly out of the park the best
strategy here?

Yes - and the mix should not have been on leash in a dog park. That's a
recipe for disaster.

She's had fun with some of the dogs - she ran a merry chase and
tussle with a 2 year old mix about her size. I think she needs
the dog interaction to learn her own social skills, but maybe
this is too much for her now? How would you proceed?

I'd try to find one-on-one buddies you can visit or host.

--
Janet Boss
www.bestfriendsdogobedience.com

"FurPaw" wrote in message:

1. Entrance. When we enter, there's an immediate "welcoming committee"
of 2-5 dogs that is a bit overwhelming.

What we have done, especially when there is a mob or a lot of unknown dogs,
is to walk around the perimeter of the dog park. This allows the dogs to
get a sniff in, and half the dogs lose interest once that's done. At the
entrance, we let dogs sniff through the gate, then practice our sit/stays.
Which essentially leads to the mobbers losing interest, as the dog isn't
coming in for a bit of time. I've also found it to be one of the best ways
to proof a stay.

2. Introductions. Molly is a bit of a dork here. While the other dogs
are still trying to sniff, she rears up and puts her paws on their backs,
which isn't welcomed.

I wouldn't physically correct her, but teach her something like a
'stand/stay' so she holds still while being sniffed. After that, she's on
her own, and unless the other dogs are being threatening and she is not
being appropriately deferential, there should be no need to intervene.

I'm concerned that she'll do this to the wrong dog and get attacked.

Most dogs wouldn't attack another for something like that, I'd think.
Warnings and threat displays, but generally no attacks.

3. Aggressive dogs. A husky and a mix were determined to tell her
what-for (growling, ears up, tail up) (and of course she just kept running
right back over to them for more and jumping up on them ???). I tried
diverting her (threw a ball, took her over to another calmer dog), without
much success.

I honestly don't think she belongs at the dog park just yet. Until you can
call her off other dogs verbally, I wouldn't take her. Once you have some
semblance of control over her off-leash, she should be good in those
situations, and you should be able to call her to you to preempt any
hostilities.

She's had fun with some of the dogs - she ran a merry chase and tussle
with a 2 year old mix about her size. I think she needs the dog
interaction to learn her own social skills, but maybe this is too much for
her now? How would you proceed?

Do obedience work first. Go during low dog density days. And never, ever
go on weekends, especially during the 'popular hours'.

Suja

"FurPaw" wrote in message
...

Janet has given you good advice already; I just wanted to add a couple of
points.

2. Introductions. Molly is a bit of a dork here. While the other dogs
are still trying to sniff, she rears up and puts her paws on their backs,
which isn't welcomed. When she's on-leash, I pop the leash, say "eh!"
and pull her off. (Yes? No?) When she's off leash, she's on her own.
Is there a way to train her to introduce herself more politely, or should
I just let the other dogs take care of that? I'm concerned that she'll
do this to the wrong dog and get attacked.

She 's a big girl If she put her paws on my dogs' back she'd squash'em!
I definitely wouldn't pop the leash or drag her off. You don't want her to
make negative connections with other dogs, also it could create or trigger
tension between the two dogs and the other dog might react in an aggressive
way.
It's early days yet but you really need to work on her recall so you can
stop her rushing up to dogs that could be aggressive or small ones that
might get squashed.
Alison





FurPaw

--
Don't believe everything that you think.

To reply, unleash the dog.

FurPaw said in
rec.pets.dogs.behavior:

Entrance.

This is the big one, in my opinion, when introducing a new
dog. The entrance sets the stage for what comes later.

When we enter, there's an immediate "welcoming
committee" of 2-5 dogs that is a bit overwhelming.

To a dog, it's more than a bit overwhelming. A doorway or a
gate is a vulnerable spot, especially when on leash - there's
no backing out and a crowd of strangers are encroaching on you
in a confined situation.

Molly
becomes quite submissive (probably ok),

Not OK in this situation, IMO. Molly is in a new situation
and now has the added burden of dealing with somewhere she
doesn't really want to be.

alternating with
jumping up and putting her paws on the backs of other dogs
(not so smart). All the dogs seem hyper-excited. What's
the best way to enter the park? Stay in the area between
the gates for a few minutes and let them sniff through the
fence and calm down? Walk right in?

Hang around the outide for a while letting her get used to the
strangeness. Wait for a relatively quiet time and then hang
out in the airlock. When it's time to go in, you lead the
way, backing in if necessary so that stranger dogs don't get
in Molly's face.

I've never been to an off-leash like you describe, but I
introduce new dogs to my household all of the time and I never
let a dog get in another dog's face (current dogs learn this
pretty quickly) when coming in the door. And I never let a
new dog get double-teamed by others.

--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.

Rocky said in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:

IMO.

By the way, I just realised I was talking to one who knows stuff
better than me.

So, my better advice is to relax and enjoy the wiles of a new
dog.

--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.

By the way, I just realised I was talking to one who knows stuff
better than me.

The OP is not the only one in the audience. I found it helpful.
--Glenn Lyford

Janet Boss wrote:
In article ,
FurPaw wrote:

I'd wait a few minutes if possible. Of course it would be nice if
owners called their dogs away. have I mentioned how much I generally
disdain dog parks due to the owners?

I'd try to give verbal corrections over physical ones. Physical ones
are more likely to increase her feeling vulnerable OR tough IMO.

Yes - and the mix should not have been on leash in a dog park. That's a
recipe for disaster.

I'd try to find one-on-one buddies you can visit or host.

Thanks, Janet. The parks are certainly a mixed bag.

FurPaw

--
Don't believe everything that you think.

To reply, unleash the dog.

Suja wrote:
"FurPaw" wrote in message:

What we have done, especially when there is a mob or a lot of unknown dogs,
is to walk around the perimeter of the dog park. This allows the dogs to
get a sniff in, and half the dogs lose interest once that's done. At the
entrance, we let dogs sniff through the gate, then practice our sit/stays.
Which essentially leads to the mobbers losing interest, as the dog isn't
coming in for a bit of time. I've also found it to be one of the best ways
to proof a stay.

Thanks - we'll be doing that from now on.

I wouldn't physically correct her, but teach her something
like a
'stand/stay' so she holds still while being sniffed. After that, she's on
her own, and unless the other dogs are being threatening and she is not
being appropriately deferential, there should be no need to intervene.

I'm concerned that she'll do this to the wrong dog and get attacked.

Most dogs wouldn't attack another for something like that, I'd think.
Warnings and threat displays, but generally no attacks.

I honestly don't think she belongs at the dog park just yet.
Until you can
call her off other dogs verbally, I wouldn't take her. Once you have some
semblance of control over her off-leash, she should be good in those
situations, and you should be able to call her to you to preempt any
hostilities.

I think you're right here...

Do obedience work first. Go during low dog density days.
And never, ever
go on weekends, especially during the 'popular hours'.

Thanks for the advice. We're working hard on obedience, and
she's making good progress at home, not so much yet when
distracted by dogs and other people. I would like to use the
park as an energy release, but I'll make sure its empty or only
contains 'known' dogs. (It's been empty at 7 AM, which I think is
a wonderful time because it's COOL.) She did well last night
again with a few of the young dogs from our obedience class, but
all of them need to get the recall nailed. When I don't know the
dogs in the park, we'll take a walk instead.


FurPaw
--
Don't believe everything that you think.

To reply, unleash the dog.

Alison wrote:
"FurPaw" wrote in message
...

Janet has given you good advice already; I just wanted to add a couple of
points.

She 's a big girl If she put her paws on my dogs' back she'd squash'em!
I definitely wouldn't pop the leash or drag her off. You don't want her to
make negative connections with other dogs, also it could create or trigger
tension between the two dogs and the other dog might react in an aggressive
way.
It's early days yet but you really need to work on her recall so you can
stop her rushing up to dogs that could be aggressive or small ones that
might get squashed.

Thanks - recall is at the top of the list, now.

FurPaw

--
Don't believe everything that you think.

To reply, unleash the dog.