"Paul E. Schoen" said in
rec.pets.dogs.behavior:

That may be, but it is an unused wasteland, along with
rec.pets.dogs

After the split happened there was no more rec.pets.dogs. Some
servers still allow posting to it (my primary one doesn't, the
Berlin server), but it's meant to be a place holder. Posting
there is like saving all of your files to your root drive.

rpd.activities? While I've tried to support it in the past, it
was always the lowest volume of the groups (even back when
..behavior was over 200 posts per day) and, because of crossover
topics and the higher volume in rpd.behavior, most posts came
here. Now that .behavior is at 5 or 10 posts per day, smaller
related groups are dieing off.

--
--Matt.

"Matt" wrote in message
...
"Paul E. Schoen" said in
rec.pets.dogs.behavior:

That may be, but it is an unused wasteland, along with
rec.pets.dogs

After the split happened there was no more rec.pets.dogs. Some
servers still allow posting to it (my primary one doesn't, the
Berlin server), but it's meant to be a place holder. Posting
there is like saving all of your files to your root drive.

rpd.activities? While I've tried to support it in the past, it
was always the lowest volume of the groups (even back when
.behavior was over 200 posts per day) and, because of crossover
topics and the higher volume in rpd.behavior, most posts came
here. Now that .behavior is at 5 or 10 posts per day, smaller
related groups are dieing off.

According to the charter:
http://www.newsdemon.com/newsgroup-info/rec.pet.dogs the behavior subgroup
is for:

This group is for the discussion of typical behavioral problems with
dogs. Examples include but are not limited to: digging, barking,
aggressive behavior, housetraining, crate training, etc. Also
appropriate is discussion of "why" dogs behave as they do and how to
work with that to eliminate some behaviors and reinforce others.

The activities subgroup is:

This group is for the discussion of activities involving dogs.
Examples include but are not limited to conformation, obedience,
field trials, herding trials, frisbee/disc competition, flyball,
hunting, sledding, backpacking/camping and hiking. Other
appropriate topics include discussion of training for the particular
activity, physical conditioning, how to hook up with activities
available in your area, etc. Sportsmanlike conduct is expected; in
particular, derogatory comments about activities you don't care
for are frowned upon. Use of keywords in the subject line to
clearly identify your activity is encouraged.

So, any discussion of obedience training is technically off-topic for RPDB.
But the split was from 1994, which was two years before I even got on-line
and knew what usenet was. At that time, web-based forums were rare and
usenet was very active. Spam was almost non-existent. Those were the "good
old days" as Dogman fondly recalls.

I think it is counterproductive to argue about what is or is not appropriate
here, especially if the arguments involve name-calling, vulgar language, and
attempts to ridicule or intimidate people who post here. It is not a kind
place, and there are no moderators to enforce rules. But if the few regulars
still standing want to attract other people, they should conduct themselves
in a civil manner.

There is, of course, no punishment for saying what you wish, but common
decency and adult self-control should be enough to make this a better place.
At least the "poopy wizard" has disappeared, so now the foulest mouth
belongs to Dogman. Maybe he has coprophagia, and can't help himself, but if
he wants to make this venue attractive to newbies and lurkers, he should use
some restraint.

To see what a "nice" group of people are like, read some of the threads on
the Cesar Millan forum: http://community.sessionswithcesar.com/forums/. You
will find heartwarming stories of people who came asking for help with
various problems, many of which are due to their own emotional and physical
health problems, and they have been given helpful support and encouragement.
People are free to accept or reject advice, and rarely are subjected to
abuse or even "I told you so".

So, I propose that we allow a broader range of topics here, including the
technically off-topic subjects of obedience, flyball, agility, and other
*activities*. Why not include stories of good *behavior*, which may be the
result of obedience training, socialization, or behavior modification. At
the present rate of posting, people will soon become disinterested and will
turn away to other forums. Even Dogman would not have returned if it were
not for a surge of activity. He is an attention seeker as we all are to some
extent. Otherwise we would just use private email. Usenet is a way to
present your questions and advice to the world.

Paul and Muttley
www.muttleydog.com

"Paul E. Schoen" wrote
"Dogman" wrote

PS: Also keep an eye on the ones you already have, because Schoen
probably wants to give them a try too.

Dogman, I think you don't understand the intent of this thread. It asks
other people to talk about their own dogs. It does not mean for you to
talk about other people or their dogs. My post is an invitation for others
to talk about *their* experiences with various collars and *their* dogs'
*behavior*. Not to post ridiculous comments about someone else or their
dogs. Perhaps it was your attempt at humor? OK. Haha!

Grin, while i would welcome a conversation on leashes, the fact is the
newsgroup became the 'Cash and Muttley show' for a bit too long in my
opinion. It takes a bit to create traffic but we are not the only 2 with
dogs.

Ever felt you were driven to discuss a particular subject when you ddnt see
one related? I may not be perfect (in fact, I ain't) but iu am trying to
open new subjects and see what works for all of us.

It excites me to see what others have with their Dogs. It excites me to see
how to maybe 'run my dog' with my bike (but the info works for many, nit
just me).

I love approval or just recognition. I will almost drool on my chest when I
say something interesting enough to be replied to. That doesnt however fit
in the long term in making this 'the Cash and Muttley show'.

I wanna hear the person with a doxie and unsure how to shift them from
pee-pad . I wanna hear the person with a German Shepard with a flea issue
ask how to control it. I want someone with a sheep dog tell me how the heck
you comb that!

I do not deny I am attention driven. I am. I however try to make this fun
for all and really, I wanna see what others have to say. Motto here is
'it's not about me, or my dog, but your dog and you'.

"Dogman" wrote

Grin, while i would welcome a conversation on leashes,
Then why not start one?

Attributes can be confusing. I was telling *him* to start one.

Say, in the .behavior group, as it pertains to training.

Lets seege to your list:

r.p.d.behavior - For the discussion of canine behavior, obedience
training, problems, fixes, etc.
r.p.d.health - For the discussion of canine health issues.
r.p d.activities - For the discussion of canine activities, e.g., agility,
field trials, etc.
r.p d.breeds - For the discusion of various canine breeds, standards,
and breeding info.
r.p.d.rescue - For the discussion of canine rescue, adoption, etc.
r.p.d.misc - For the discussion of any other canine topic, photo
links, etc.
r.p.d.info - Official newsgroup, breed, activity, etc., FAQs.

Only RPD.health and RPD.behaviour exist. The rest are dead. Directing
people to dead areas is non-functional as it wastes both your time.

Deal with what exists, not dream of what used to exit.

Ever felt you were driven to discuss a particular subject when you ddnt
see
one related?

Why not just discuss a particular subject then, in the appropriate
group?

Pick one.


This or the health one.

It excites me to see
how to maybe 'run my dog' with my bike (but the info works for many, nit
just me).

You've pursued such a discussion already, and what it appears to boil
down to (thus far) is that it's not possible to use the Springer with
your current bike (of course, you could always buy another bike, a
cheap or used one), and Skijoring is probably out of the question for
a dog with spinal problems, so maybe running with your dog is not
currently feasible, unless you (or someone else?) take him jogging?

Skjorning was a link that lead to another lead much like the spinger but
attachable to my bike.

Side topic. Had my Doc visit today. Doc fell in love with Cash and agrees
this is one pooch I'm well suited with. Doc tried to walk him and Cash
almost dragged him about. I said 'Stop' and took the leash. Slack mostly
and if not slack, slight pull but not bad with me. Sheesh, Doc was
slippling him treats by the time I left.

I wanna hear the person with a doxie and unsure how to shift them from
pee-pad .

Just stop using the pee pad (yes, just stop), and start taking the dog

I wanna hear real people with issues and how they are working it out and see
people here help them best as they can.

It's not about referring people to dead groups. Also, started my fair share
of new threads., time to see another do it.

On Sat, 15 May 2010 00:52:16 -0400, "cshenk" wrote:

Lets seege to your list:

What does seege mean?

r.p.d.behavior - For the discussion of canine behavior, obedience
training, problems, fixes, etc.
r.p.d.health - For the discussion of canine health issues.
r.p d.activities - For the discussion of canine activities, e.g., agility,
field trials, etc.
r.p d.breeds - For the discusion of various canine breeds, standards,
and breeding info.
r.p.d.rescue - For the discussion of canine rescue, adoption, etc.
r.p.d.misc - For the discussion of any other canine topic, photo
links, etc.
r.p.d.info - Official newsgroup, breed, activity, etc., FAQs.

Only RPD.health and RPD.behaviour exist. The rest are dead. Directing
people to dead areas is non-functional as it wastes both your time.

I don't know what you mean by dead, but the above newsgroups exist,
and there are occasional posts on them, particularly rescue and
breeds. Just saying something doesn't make it true, you know.

Deal with what exists, not dream of what used to exit.

They exist. And I wish you'd learn to use spellcheck. Reading your
posts gives me a headache.

I wanna hear real people with issues and how they are working it out and see
people here help them best as they can.

It's not about referring people to dead groups. Also, started my fair share
of new threads., time to see another do it.

So it's all about what you want it to be about?

On Fri, 14 May 2010 19:32:13 -0400, "cshenk" wrote:


I love approval or just recognition. I will almost drool on my chest when I
say something interesting enough to be replied to. That doesnt however fit
in the long term in making this 'the Cash and Muttley show'.

I think you, and maybe Paul, are the only one who thought this
newsgroup was becoming the Cash and Muttley show.

I wanna hear the person with a doxie and unsure how to shift them from
pee-pad . I wanna hear the person with a German Shepard with a flea issue
ask how to control it. I want someone with a sheep dog tell me how the heck
you comb that!

But it's not a grooming newsgroup or a health newsgroup. When
rpdbehavior was really active, there were lots of off-topic
discusisons, but those were in the midst of on-topic discussions.
This also isn't a teaching newsgroup, so it's unlikely that someone
with a sheepdog is going to come on and tell everyone how s/he grooms
his/her dog, anymore than I would start pontificating about grooming
Borzoi or Siberians or what have you. And there is no such thing as a
German Shepard (it's Shepherd, as in sheep-herding dog, which is what
a German Shepherd is).

I do not deny I am attention driven. I am. I however try to make this fun
for all and really, I wanna see what others have to say. Motto here is
'it's not about me, or my dog, but your dog and you'.

You're the only one trying to make this all about you and your dog.
If people have questions, they'll ask them, like starcat just did. It
seems that you're trying to make this newsgroup into something it
isn't meant to be, is not, and never will be. There are all sorts of
groups out there for chatting about dogs or other subjects, and most
of them are moderated so people can't be mean. Or, for people who
really love attention, there's always Facebook, where people post to
the world what they're doing and how they're feeling and what they
think about any and every conceivable subject.

"Dogman" wrote
"cshenk" wrote:

Grin, while i would welcome a conversation on leashes,
Then why not start one?

Attributes can be confusing. I was telling *him* to start one.

Who is "him"?

The person you deleted from the attributes then asked who he was.

Say, in the .behavior group, as it pertains to training.

Lets seege to your list:

What does that mean?

Means I moved your list out of the order of your post.

r.p.d.behavior - For the discussion of canine behavior, obedience
training, problems, fixes, etc.
r.p.d.health - For the discussion of canine health issues.

Both valid and I am in both.

r.p d.activities - For the discussion of canine activities, e.g.,
agility,
field trials, etc.
r.p d.breeds - For the discusion of various canine breeds,
standards,
and breeding info.
r.p.d.rescue - For the discussion of canine rescue, adoption, etc.
r.p.d.misc - For the discussion of any other canine topic, photo
links, etc.
r.p.d.info - Official newsgroup, breed, activity, etc., FAQs.

Only RPD.health and RPD.behaviour exist. The rest are dead.

No, they are not dead. They exist, and they are very welcoming to
newcomers. Just make it a point to initiate pertinent discussions in
the appropriate group, and then, voila! They will, just as surely as
the Frankenstein monster, come alive!

They have insufficient traffic to be worth pulling. As newsgroups get
smaller because more people are using facebook and other venues, the traffic
tends to concentrate to the remaining larger ones.

No, talking about "running their dog" in the .behavior group wastes
the time of people who have no interest in learning about ways to run
their dog.

It was a thread on training and seeking advice on the best ways to go about
it. People not interested just could ignore the thread.

By taking flea prevention posts to .activities:

??? There was a thread on that? All I saw was Char's bit on how the
vaccinatioons and flea meds were bad.

2. Be adhering to newsgroup protocol.

LOL, wasn't it you who told me not to be a net-nanny?

All you have to do is to start using it. Today, for example.

So, you don't like the traffic that has been building here? Me I think it's
a good thing that more are talking.

Why do you insist on being so obtuse?

Why do you feel you have to control the traffic?

Skjorning was a link that lead to another lead much like the spinger but
attachable to my bike.

So...what?

So, I found useful advice here on a tool I can use to help me train my dog
better. I showed it to my spine-doc yesterday (had him bring up the link
and ran the demo online). He thinks it seems neat and wanted me to check
with the vets to make sure the harness style will work right with it.

Short version: stopped by vet this morning with printed pics and note from
my spine-doc (no potholes and level surface only). Vet says yes if I go
slow and to watch hot pavement. Same distances allowed (1/2-3/4 miles
only). Vet wants him dual leashed with Charlotte on the other side at the
start until he's well used to it. No collar leashing allowed, but harness
is perfect and he'll get more exercise. We have to watch his behavior
carefully so he doesnt get startled. That brings us round circle to the
thread on running and behavior to watch for.

Are you just unable to focus on just one topic at a time?

Grin, men think linearly. Women have tangents.

about, for example, training, could do so in .behavior, without having
to be inundated with all the "side topics"?

Then ignore me. Kill filters work fine for that.

Feel free to talk about anything you want there.

But please don't do that here, in .behavior.

Forgive me, I was unaware you were the moderator of this group.

On Sat, 15 May 2010 13:15:08 -0400, "cshenk" wrote:


Grin, men think linearly. Women have tangents.

Speak for yourself, please.

about, for example, training, could do so in .behavior, without having
to be inundated with all the "side topics"?

Then ignore me. Kill filters work fine for that.

Feel free to talk about anything you want there.

But please don't do that here, in .behavior.

Forgive me, I was unaware you were the moderator of this group.

What's different about Dogman telling you what shouldn't get discussed
here and you telling him what should be?

"Dogman" wrote
"cshenk" wrote:

Grin, while i would welcome a conversation on leashes,
Then why not start one?

Attributes can be confusing. I was telling *him* to start one.

Who is "him"?

The person you deleted from the attributes then asked who he was.

Then why not use his name, to eliminate any confusion? You were
talking about a lot of things, Carol, not just Schoen's leash.

Paul I think it was.

Say, in the .behavior group, as it pertains to training.

Lets seege to your list:

What does that mean?

Means I moved your list out of the order of your post.

I looked up the word "seege," and lo and behold, I found no such word.
So somewhere in that brain of yours, the word "seege" somehow means
"moving a list out of order"?
If not, what exactly does it mean? And in what dictionary did you find
it?
Look, I don't want to raz someone who may have a legitimate learning
disorder. Do you have one?

Yes, I have dyslexia. It was mentioned in a post to Char.

It's nothing to be embarassed about.

Nope, nor am I worried if my spelling tends to be 'unique' or folks notice
it. I got over that a long time ago. Now and again I trip over a word I
never knew I spelled wrong as it looks right to me.

Means (even if not spelled right) to 'shift' or 'to change' or 'move
sideways'. Transition or to transit sideways would be another meaning. I
tried dictionary.com but didnt find it. Irritating.

r.p.d.behavior - For the discussion of canine behavior, obedience
training, problems, fixes, etc.
r.p.d.health - For the discussion of canine health issues.

Both valid and I am in both.

You can be in any or all of them.

Yes, *obvuiously*.

There's a post right now in .activities; someone wants to discuss
running their dog.

There have been 15 posts this year in rpd.activities. They are all spam
except your *own* post asking about springers. Apparently trying to move
people to there is my guess?

Nothing wrong with that but if all that group has is spam in the last 5
months, (without even a reply to the spam) I call it a dead group.

And it's a chance for you to do the right thing, Carol.

I prefer to try to get more people here. Get 'a' group going well then span
out when you need to split things due to too much traffic.

They have little traffic because inconsiderate people like you insist
upon ignoring them.

Then that is how it is.

No, talking about "running their dog" in the .behavior group wastes
the time of people who have no interest in learning about ways to run
their dog.

It was a thread on training and seeking advice on the best ways to go
about
it. People not interested just could ignore the thread.

Or..according to Usenet protocol, you could have taken the post to the
right group, .activities.

Is Caroline even bothering to read that one anymore?

??? There was a thread on that? All I saw was Char's bit on how the
vaccinatioons and flea meds were bad.

That was my mistake.

No worries. Happens.

I meant to say "running my dog", not flea prevention.

So you feel that discussing training in general and behavior in specific is
not allowed here? Personally I found Caroline's information invaulable and
have more questions for her. They *may* help others as well. That it lead
to a specific training device and now back to how to use it best, shouldnt
be a problem. I want to learn from her and you shouldnt be playing
net-nanny preventing it.

2. Be adhering to newsgroup protocol.

LOL, wasn't it you who told me not to be a net-nanny?

That's not being a net-nanny, Carol.
It's an attempt to get the dog groups running like they used to run.

Get over it. They wont. Cox is cutting newsgroups too. Thats the last big
provider of 'one stop shopping' for newsgroups. I'll shift to giganews. We
will get smaller and concentrating assets to groups that have valid traffic
is going to happen.

So, you don't like the traffic that has been building here? Me I think
it's
a good thing that more are talking.

It is a good thing, and it could be an even better thing if the
talking was taking place in the right group.

Wishful thinking. I prefer to live in the real world. rpd.activities was
really popular in 2005. You can see it drift down until it is just 'come
see my blog' or 'buy this tool from me' spam.

Wanna revive it? You do it. I'm working on this one to some level of
success.

To make it even easier for newbies to find information they're looking
for. For example, what newbie would ever think to look for information
regarding flea prevention in the .behavior group?

Um, there was no good info on flea prevention here.

Why do you insist on being so obtuse?

Why do you feel you have to control the traffic?

Because it makes it easier for newbies to find the information they're
looking for, because it's the right way to do things, and because it's
Usenet protocol.

Interesting. I find it non-functional to direct people to dead groups. I
guess we just have to agree to disagree on that one.

Skjorning was a link that lead to another lead much like the spinger but
attachable to my bike.

So...what?

So, I found useful advice here on a tool I can use to help me train my dog
better. I showed it to my spine-doc yesterday (had him bring up the link
and ran the demo online). He thinks it seems neat and wanted me to check
with the vets to make sure the harness style will work right with it.

Short version: stopped by vet this morning with printed pics and note
from
my spine-doc (no potholes and level surface only). Vet says yes if I go
slow and to watch hot pavement. Same distances allowed (1/2-3/4 miles
only). Vet wants him dual leashed with Charlotte on the other side at the
start until he's well used to it. No collar leashing allowed, but harness
is perfect and he'll get more exercise. We have to watch his behavior
carefully so he doesnt get startled. That brings us round circle to the
thread on running and behavior to watch for.

I read all of the above. Then I read it again. And I still have no
idea what that "useful device" actually is.

http://www.thedogoutdoors.com/dog-bike-leash.html

And furthermore, this belongs in .activities, and there's already a
thread about this very topic over there.


No, there is a single post by YOU trying to move the traffic over there but
Caroline, who knows this stuff is HERE.

Are you just unable to focus on just one topic at a time?

Grin, men think linearly. Women have tangents.

Could tangents by any chance mean "scatterbrained"?

If you prefer to believe that.

Otherwise I have no idea what "tangents" mean. I inspected my wife at
great length (much to her delight) and I found no "tangents."

Hehe I bet that was a fun trip!

I'll try to back down though on 'CEO' sorta terms usage here. There was no
intent to confuse although it happened.

Moreoever, I don't think the vast majority of women, or men, are
scatterbrained, but some obviously are.

Are they the ones you're referring to?

I didt use the term scatterbrained, you did. For a person who desires only
on topic posts, tyhis is a pretty odd request.
Ask me again if you want more OT stuff.

about, for example, training, could do so in .behavior, without having
to be inundated with all the "side topics"?

Then ignore me. Kill filters work fine for that.

I can do that, of course, but I'd rather try and convince you to do
the right thing, and to have you understand why it's the right thing.
I'm a patient man.

Ok, do you grasp the concept that your posting one note in rpd.activities
doesnt make it work to move a topic on how to train a dog to run with a bike
when all the folks I can find who have experience are here? Just checking.

But please don't do that here, in .behavior.

Forgive me, I was unaware you were the moderator of this group.

I'm not the moderator of any newsgroup, Carol, but I would like to see
the dog groups rebound. If I can get people like you to help me do
that, it may still be possible.
Why would you not want to help me?

Functionality. Grow one group up until it needs to be split. There is no
critical traffic load here yet.

When I came in about 6 months ago (guessing) the traffic was 1-2 a week. It
seemed to be largely Char responding to every post with raw feeding and use
no meds or vaccines. Now we run as much as 20 a day.

My take is give it time to grow from seedling to sapling before asking it be
'split' again to what suited in 2005 or so with multiple rpd groups.

On Sat, 15 May 2010 15:16:18 -0400, "cshenk" wrote:


Yes, I have dyslexia. It was mentioned in a post to Char.

It's nothing to be embarassed about.

Nope, nor am I worried if my spelling tends to be 'unique' or folks notice
it. I got over that a long time ago. Now and again I trip over a word I
never knew I spelled wrong as it looks right to me.

You know, Carol, you are not the only person in the world, or even on
this newsgroup. Your spelling isn't unique, it's often indecipherable
(you typed a word with a number in the middle recently). I happen to
have nystagmus and, at the ripe old age of 52, cataracts, and your
posts are sometimes so difficult for me to read that they give me a
headache. Your "I don't give a **** if I spell things right" is
really pretty inconsiderate, especially for a person who has preached
so much about people being kind and civil here. I guess the bottom
line is that it's all about you, eh?