Hi,

I would really appreciate any advice. This is the story:

We have an 8 year old female Boerboel (South African breed; check
http://www.boerboelsa.co.za/ for more info), an 8 month old male
Boerboel & a 1 year old female lab. The female boerbul has been
spayed, the lab came off her first heat about 2 months ago (we want to
breed with her); the male bourboel pup has not been neutered (also for
breeding purposes). All three dogs have mixed with each other well and
there have been no signs of aggression except for the odd warning
growl. Two days ago though, the older female Boerboel attacked the
female lab (almost killed her; still not sure how she got away).
Anyway after 3 hours of vet vists, the lab is bruised and battered but
alive and back home. Yet everytime the lab and boerboel come into
contact, there's a lot of animosity; they almost can't wait to get
back into the ring and finish the fight. Both my wife and I work
during the day and we can't risk leaving them outside together again.
I've read a bit that suggest that the 2 bitches are fighting for
social standing...

Some of my questions a
It's possible to fence the older dog in; is this not going to
aggrevate the situation? I don't want to 'drug' the dog to keep her
placid (what's the point?). A muzzle is also an option but again is it
not postponing the inevitable. I'm looking for a viable alternative to
putting the older dog down (she's quite old and had a good life) but I
can't have my dogs tearing each other apart.

Please help...
David

From: (DavidB)

We have an 8 year old female Boerboel (South African breed; check
http://www.boerboelsa.co.za/ for more info), an 8 month old male
Boerboel & a 1 year old female lab. The female boerbul has been
spayed, the lab came off her first heat about 2 months ago (we want to
breed with her); the male bourboel pup has not been neutered (also for
breeding purposes).

Sounds like a lot of breeding plans - what's your goal? Boerboels are not a
breed that tends to live in groups as easily as some.

Obviously, they are a rare breed, but I don't know how much the US club and
breeders control breeding. Have only met 2 in person at this point!
Furthering the breed in the US is certainly something being done, but why the
lab? What does she bring to the lab world that makes her desirable to be bred?
Do you really want to manage a litter of puppies in your current canine pack
situation?

Indeed, you cannot leave these dogs together unattended. Whether they can be
together under your supervision is more a question of your skills and training
(what training have they received or are receiving?) than anything else - they
can't be allowed to make the choices.

I'm looking for a viable alternative to
putting the older dog down (she's quite old and had a good life) but I
can't have my dogs tearing each other apart.

No, but you owe allegiance to your 8 year old dog as your beloved friend and
companion as well. Even considering putting her down, as she's had a "good and
old life" is quite sad.

What kind of containment are you currently using? Are all of the dogs outside
all day? In a fenced yard? Kennel? Farm?

Separation is imperative. The Boerboel's outside, lab inside? All inside in
sep areas of house? Keeping everyone safe is the top priority, and sometimes
management is the only answer. It may not be what you expected, but it's what
you've got. Intact bitches can have pretty violent fights (how long has the
female Boerboel been spayed?).

Training for all - in person help - separate daytime quraters - and spaying the
lab would be my choices.


Janet Boss
Best Friends Dog Obedience
"Nice Manners for the Family Pet"
Voted "Best of Baltimore 2001" - Baltimore Magazine
www.bestfriendsdogobedience.com

From: (DavidB)

We have an 8 year old female Boerboel (South African breed; check
http://www.boerboelsa.co.za/ for more info), an 8 month old male
Boerboel & a 1 year old female lab. The female boerbul has been
spayed, the lab came off her first heat about 2 months ago (we want to
breed with her); the male bourboel pup has not been neutered (also for
breeding purposes).

Sounds like a lot of breeding plans - what's your goal? Boerboels are not a
breed that tends to live in groups as easily as some.

Obviously, they are a rare breed, but I don't know how much the US club and
breeders control breeding. Have only met 2 in person at this point!
Furthering the breed in the US is certainly something being done, but why the
lab? What does she bring to the lab world that makes her desirable to be bred?
Do you really want to manage a litter of puppies in your current canine pack
situation?

Indeed, you cannot leave these dogs together unattended. Whether they can be
together under your supervision is more a question of your skills and training
(what training have they received or are receiving?) than anything else - they
can't be allowed to make the choices.

I'm looking for a viable alternative to
putting the older dog down (she's quite old and had a good life) but I
can't have my dogs tearing each other apart.

No, but you owe allegiance to your 8 year old dog as your beloved friend and
companion as well. Even considering putting her down, as she's had a "good and
old life" is quite sad.

What kind of containment are you currently using? Are all of the dogs outside
all day? In a fenced yard? Kennel? Farm?

Separation is imperative. The Boerboel's outside, lab inside? All inside in
sep areas of house? Keeping everyone safe is the top priority, and sometimes
management is the only answer. It may not be what you expected, but it's what
you've got. Intact bitches can have pretty violent fights (how long has the
female Boerboel been spayed?).

Training for all - in person help - separate daytime quraters - and spaying the
lab would be my choices.


Janet Boss
Best Friends Dog Obedience
"Nice Manners for the Family Pet"
Voted "Best of Baltimore 2001" - Baltimore Magazine
www.bestfriendsdogobedience.com

From: (DavidB)

We have an 8 year old female Boerboel (South African breed; check
http://www.boerboelsa.co.za/ for more info), an 8 month old male
Boerboel & a 1 year old female lab. The female boerbul has been
spayed, the lab came off her first heat about 2 months ago (we want to
breed with her); the male bourboel pup has not been neutered (also for
breeding purposes).

Sounds like a lot of breeding plans - what's your goal? Boerboels are not a
breed that tends to live in groups as easily as some.

Obviously, they are a rare breed, but I don't know how much the US club and
breeders control breeding. Have only met 2 in person at this point!
Furthering the breed in the US is certainly something being done, but why the
lab? What does she bring to the lab world that makes her desirable to be bred?
Do you really want to manage a litter of puppies in your current canine pack
situation?

Indeed, you cannot leave these dogs together unattended. Whether they can be
together under your supervision is more a question of your skills and training
(what training have they received or are receiving?) than anything else - they
can't be allowed to make the choices.

I'm looking for a viable alternative to
putting the older dog down (she's quite old and had a good life) but I
can't have my dogs tearing each other apart.

No, but you owe allegiance to your 8 year old dog as your beloved friend and
companion as well. Even considering putting her down, as she's had a "good and
old life" is quite sad.

What kind of containment are you currently using? Are all of the dogs outside
all day? In a fenced yard? Kennel? Farm?

Separation is imperative. The Boerboel's outside, lab inside? All inside in
sep areas of house? Keeping everyone safe is the top priority, and sometimes
management is the only answer. It may not be what you expected, but it's what
you've got. Intact bitches can have pretty violent fights (how long has the
female Boerboel been spayed?).

Training for all - in person help - separate daytime quraters - and spaying the
lab would be my choices.


Janet Boss
Best Friends Dog Obedience
"Nice Manners for the Family Pet"
Voted "Best of Baltimore 2001" - Baltimore Magazine
www.bestfriendsdogobedience.com

"DavidB" wrote in message
om...
Hi,

I would really appreciate any advice. This is the story:

We have an 8 year old female Boerboel (South African breed; check
http://www.boerboelsa.co.za/ for more info),

it looks like the FAQ on that very site has some answers,
http://www.boerboelsa.co.za/faq.html check number 7.

basically, you're going to have to keep them separated whenever you can't
directly supervise, as Janet suggests. you might check some pit bull sites
for more info on this, this is something that pit bull (and other bully
breed) owners deal with on a day to day basis.
my bullies don't fight each other, but never the less, they are kept in
separate crates (where they can't see each other) whenever i'm not home or
when i'm sleeping. it's the only way i can be sure they're definitely going
to be safe. i also supervise their play and give them "time outs" when play
gets too rough for my taste. i supervise their feeding directly (i stand
over them and watch), and they only get special treats (bones, greenies,
etc) when they're in their separate crates. basically, any toy or treat that
they might fight over is not allowed unless they're seperated. dog
aggression is often impossible to "cure", so it is something you have to
learn to manage.

they look like great dogs, BTW. though i can't say i like all the anti-pit
bull comments on the web site you posted...

-kelly

"DavidB" wrote in message
om...
Hi,

I would really appreciate any advice. This is the story:

We have an 8 year old female Boerboel (South African breed; check
http://www.boerboelsa.co.za/ for more info),

it looks like the FAQ on that very site has some answers,
http://www.boerboelsa.co.za/faq.html check number 7.

basically, you're going to have to keep them separated whenever you can't
directly supervise, as Janet suggests. you might check some pit bull sites
for more info on this, this is something that pit bull (and other bully
breed) owners deal with on a day to day basis.
my bullies don't fight each other, but never the less, they are kept in
separate crates (where they can't see each other) whenever i'm not home or
when i'm sleeping. it's the only way i can be sure they're definitely going
to be safe. i also supervise their play and give them "time outs" when play
gets too rough for my taste. i supervise their feeding directly (i stand
over them and watch), and they only get special treats (bones, greenies,
etc) when they're in their separate crates. basically, any toy or treat that
they might fight over is not allowed unless they're seperated. dog
aggression is often impossible to "cure", so it is something you have to
learn to manage.

they look like great dogs, BTW. though i can't say i like all the anti-pit
bull comments on the web site you posted...

-kelly

"DavidB" wrote in message
om...
Hi,

I would really appreciate any advice. This is the story:

We have an 8 year old female Boerboel (South African breed; check
http://www.boerboelsa.co.za/ for more info),

it looks like the FAQ on that very site has some answers,
http://www.boerboelsa.co.za/faq.html check number 7.

basically, you're going to have to keep them separated whenever you can't
directly supervise, as Janet suggests. you might check some pit bull sites
for more info on this, this is something that pit bull (and other bully
breed) owners deal with on a day to day basis.
my bullies don't fight each other, but never the less, they are kept in
separate crates (where they can't see each other) whenever i'm not home or
when i'm sleeping. it's the only way i can be sure they're definitely going
to be safe. i also supervise their play and give them "time outs" when play
gets too rough for my taste. i supervise their feeding directly (i stand
over them and watch), and they only get special treats (bones, greenies,
etc) when they're in their separate crates. basically, any toy or treat that
they might fight over is not allowed unless they're seperated. dog
aggression is often impossible to "cure", so it is something you have to
learn to manage.

they look like great dogs, BTW. though i can't say i like all the anti-pit
bull comments on the web site you posted...

-kelly

Subject: Dogs attack each other
From: (DavidB)
Date: Wed, Oct 1, 2003 7:49 AM
Message-id:

Hi,

I would really appreciate any advice. This is the story:

We have an 8 year old female Boerboel (South African breed; check
http://www.boerboelsa.co.za/ for more info),

BEAUTIFUL BREED!

an 8 month old male
Boerboel & a 1 year old female lab. The female boerbul has been
spayed, the lab came off her first heat about 2 months ago (we want to
breed with her); the male bourboel pup has not been neutered (also for
breeding purposes). All three dogs have mixed with each other well and
there have been no signs of aggression except for the odd warning
growl. Two days ago though, the older female Boerboel attacked the
female lab (almost killed her; still not sure how she got away).
Anyway after 3 hours of vet vists, the lab is bruised and battered but
alive and back home. Yet everytime the lab and boerboel come into
contact, there's a lot of animosity; they almost can't wait to get
back into the ring and finish the fight. Both my wife and I work
during the day and we can't risk leaving them outside together again.
I've read a bit that suggest that the 2 bitches are fighting for
social standing...

Some of my questions a
It's possible to fence the older dog in; is this not going to
aggrevate the situation? I don't want to 'drug' the dog to keep her
placid (what's the point?). A muzzle is also an option but again is it
not postponing the inevitable. I'm looking for a viable alternative to
putting the older dog down (she's quite old and had a good life) but I
can't have my dogs tearing each other apart.

Please help...
David

The older female was there first,so is bothered by the young female, especially
when the dog is in heat.

How long have you had the Lab? What has the interaction been before this
fight?

Now the male was away from the Lab right? Or are you saying you wanted to breed
both of these dogs together?

If these were my dogs, unless I was home with them for the safety of the Lab,I
would confine the Lab, to a safe place.

Then when you are home let them interact,as you will be there on top of the
situation and hopefully you know all the signs of *attack mode*

An 8 year old dog is NOT old and I am sad to hear you say you have considered
putting her down.

I know she is spayed now,but have you bred her?

Has she lived with other females?

Your Lab probably did not *get away* but was let go, as I am sure she did not
put up much of a fight,as they do not have that in them ,as like your older
girl has.

BTW is the male related to the older female?

Paulette~

















"The only thing about resisting temptation
is you might not get another chance"

Subject: Dogs attack each other
From: (DavidB)
Date: Wed, Oct 1, 2003 7:49 AM
Message-id:

Hi,

I would really appreciate any advice. This is the story:

We have an 8 year old female Boerboel (South African breed; check
http://www.boerboelsa.co.za/ for more info),

BEAUTIFUL BREED!

an 8 month old male
Boerboel & a 1 year old female lab. The female boerbul has been
spayed, the lab came off her first heat about 2 months ago (we want to
breed with her); the male bourboel pup has not been neutered (also for
breeding purposes). All three dogs have mixed with each other well and
there have been no signs of aggression except for the odd warning
growl. Two days ago though, the older female Boerboel attacked the
female lab (almost killed her; still not sure how she got away).
Anyway after 3 hours of vet vists, the lab is bruised and battered but
alive and back home. Yet everytime the lab and boerboel come into
contact, there's a lot of animosity; they almost can't wait to get
back into the ring and finish the fight. Both my wife and I work
during the day and we can't risk leaving them outside together again.
I've read a bit that suggest that the 2 bitches are fighting for
social standing...

Some of my questions a
It's possible to fence the older dog in; is this not going to
aggrevate the situation? I don't want to 'drug' the dog to keep her
placid (what's the point?). A muzzle is also an option but again is it
not postponing the inevitable. I'm looking for a viable alternative to
putting the older dog down (she's quite old and had a good life) but I
can't have my dogs tearing each other apart.

Please help...
David

The older female was there first,so is bothered by the young female, especially
when the dog is in heat.

How long have you had the Lab? What has the interaction been before this
fight?

Now the male was away from the Lab right? Or are you saying you wanted to breed
both of these dogs together?

If these were my dogs, unless I was home with them for the safety of the Lab,I
would confine the Lab, to a safe place.

Then when you are home let them interact,as you will be there on top of the
situation and hopefully you know all the signs of *attack mode*

An 8 year old dog is NOT old and I am sad to hear you say you have considered
putting her down.

I know she is spayed now,but have you bred her?

Has she lived with other females?

Your Lab probably did not *get away* but was let go, as I am sure she did not
put up much of a fight,as they do not have that in them ,as like your older
girl has.

BTW is the male related to the older female?

Paulette~

















"The only thing about resisting temptation
is you might not get another chance"

Subject: Dogs attack each other
From: (DavidB)
Date: Wed, Oct 1, 2003 7:49 AM
Message-id:

Hi,

I would really appreciate any advice. This is the story:

We have an 8 year old female Boerboel (South African breed; check
http://www.boerboelsa.co.za/ for more info),

BEAUTIFUL BREED!

an 8 month old male
Boerboel & a 1 year old female lab. The female boerbul has been
spayed, the lab came off her first heat about 2 months ago (we want to
breed with her); the male bourboel pup has not been neutered (also for
breeding purposes). All three dogs have mixed with each other well and
there have been no signs of aggression except for the odd warning
growl. Two days ago though, the older female Boerboel attacked the
female lab (almost killed her; still not sure how she got away).
Anyway after 3 hours of vet vists, the lab is bruised and battered but
alive and back home. Yet everytime the lab and boerboel come into
contact, there's a lot of animosity; they almost can't wait to get
back into the ring and finish the fight. Both my wife and I work
during the day and we can't risk leaving them outside together again.
I've read a bit that suggest that the 2 bitches are fighting for
social standing...

Some of my questions a
It's possible to fence the older dog in; is this not going to
aggrevate the situation? I don't want to 'drug' the dog to keep her
placid (what's the point?). A muzzle is also an option but again is it
not postponing the inevitable. I'm looking for a viable alternative to
putting the older dog down (she's quite old and had a good life) but I
can't have my dogs tearing each other apart.

Please help...
David

The older female was there first,so is bothered by the young female, especially
when the dog is in heat.

How long have you had the Lab? What has the interaction been before this
fight?

Now the male was away from the Lab right? Or are you saying you wanted to breed
both of these dogs together?

If these were my dogs, unless I was home with them for the safety of the Lab,I
would confine the Lab, to a safe place.

Then when you are home let them interact,as you will be there on top of the
situation and hopefully you know all the signs of *attack mode*

An 8 year old dog is NOT old and I am sad to hear you say you have considered
putting her down.

I know she is spayed now,but have you bred her?

Has she lived with other females?

Your Lab probably did not *get away* but was let go, as I am sure she did not
put up much of a fight,as they do not have that in them ,as like your older
girl has.

BTW is the male related to the older female?

Paulette~

















"The only thing about resisting temptation
is you might not get another chance"