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#1
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Help!! Dog chewing everything in sight!! On her way out!!!!
Please help. I have a female german shepard that has chewed a recliner,
sofa, carpet, shoes, picture frames, games, etc. It just goes on and on. She has chew toys, squeaky toys, knotted ropes, but is literally chewing me out of house and home. Replacements are going to cost me close to $3000.00! What can I do to stop the chewing!! When I am home with her, she is good as gold most of the time, but when I'm not home... it's a free for all. I can no longer keep her in a kennel, she chews through the fence! I've been through three of them! I am about ready to get rid of her. She is a beautiful dog, mostly black with tan paws and chest. But her beauty will only get her so far.. and it almost has her in a shelter! Please help me!! |
#2
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"MommaMia" wrote in message
lkaboutpets.com... Please help. I have a female german shepard that has chewed a recliner, sofa, carpet, shoes, picture frames, games, etc. It just goes on and on. She has chew toys, squeaky toys, knotted ropes, but is literally chewing me out of house and home. Replacements are going to cost me close to $3000.00! What can I do to stop the chewing!! When I am home with her, she is good as gold most of the time, but when I'm not home... it's a free for all. I can no longer keep her in a kennel, she chews through the fence! I've been through three of them! I am about ready to get rid of her. She is a beautiful dog, mostly black with tan paws and chest. But her beauty will only get her so far.. and it almost has her in a shelter! Please help me!! And you think putting her in a shelter, with the behavioral probem she has, will land her in a home that'll keep her? Have you talked to your vet about this? She may be suffering from separation anxiety and if that's the case she can't help herself. There are training methods designed to help dogs with SA. If you're committed and don't want to abandon her to a shelter where she'll live for a couple of weeks before being euthanized then do some research on Separation Anxiety. Try employing a training method to help her and, if it looks like its helping but just isn't enough, talk to your veterinarian about a possible medical aid to assist with the training. -- Tara |
#3
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MommaMia wrote:
Please help. I have a female german shepard that has chewed a recliner, sofa, carpet, shoes, picture frames, games, etc. How old is your dog? Dogs, lacking hands, tend to explore their world with their mouths. They are not born with any innate knowledge of what they should or should not chew, and it is our job to help them distinguish between acceptable and unacceptable behavior. What can I do to stop the chewing!! Lots of things. First and foremost, make sure that she has plenty of exercise, both physical and mental. Being a German Shepherd, she's more than likely a smart dog, and if under exercised (especially if her brain is not exercised), will find ways to keep herself busy and entertained. Usually in ways that humans find unacceptable. Get her into some obedience training, and if you've done the basics, find a more advanced level. You can also explore other doggie sports such as agility and tracking with her. Keep in mind that a tired dog is a good dog. When no one is home to supervise her, leave her in either a puppy proofed room, or in a crate. She should not be in a crate for longer than 4 or 5 hours at a time, so make sure that someone is around (a dog walker, a neighbor, etc.) to let her out periodically so she can relieve herself and stretch her legs. When you are home, keep her close to you, and if she ever seems interested in inappropriate objects, let her know that those are not chew toys, and give her the more appropriate object. Always praise her when she makes right choices. Basically this will require some time and consistancy from you. her. She is a beautiful dog, mostly black with tan paws and chest. But her beauty will only get her so far.. and it almost has her in a shelter! Please help me!! I hope it won't come to that, and that the two of you can work through this. If you feel that rehoming her is the best option, don't dump her in a shelter, where she is likely to get put down. Look into a German Shepherd Rescue near you. Heck, they may be able to give you pointers and help you so that you can keep your dog. Suja |
#4
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I feel a HOW DY coming on.
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#5
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Mia is a little over a year old and full of puppy energy. She is very
loving and very smart, but my home is not big enough to have a puppy proof room. I will give your suggestions a try, and I do hope they work. I am running out of options. Unfortunately the crate idea is not an option, she chewed through hers as well as three kennels. Thank you for your help, it is greatly appreciated. |
#6
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MommaMia wrote:
Mia is a little over a year old and full of puppy energy. That explains a lot. Young dogs can be hell on wheels if the energy is not properly channeled. Unfortunately the crate idea is not an option, she chewed through hers as well as three kennels. Are you saying that she has chewed her way through metal crates? Like this one: http://tinyurl.com/aj3qk? Was she introduced to it properly, and does she see it as a safe place to hang out? If that is the case, you may want to explore what Tara said, and see if she has any anxiety related issues. A LOT of dogs are not capable of handling a lot of freedom early in their lives, and need to be confined for their own safety. Some friends of mine have had dogs that only became trustworthy in the house after 2 or 3 years, and even then, they were allowed free access for a short amount at a time, which was lengthened if the dog behaved well. Thank you for your help, it is greatly appreciated. You're welcome. I hope you can find a way to keep her safe and contained when you are not home. You may want to consider a doggie daycare if she is good with other dogs, in lieu of letting her eat your house. Suja |
#7
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buzzsaw wrote: I feel a HOW DY coming on. HOWEDY MommaMia, MommaMia wrote: Mia is a little over a year old and full of puppy energy. You mean she's HYPERACTIVE. She is very loving and very smart, but my home is not big enough to have a puppy proof room. That's ridiculous. You can't lock a dog in a crate or private destruction proof room and call that considerate, human, reasonable treatment for ANY thing other than a criminally insane person. I will give your suggestions a try, and I do hope they work. Those methods are the CAUSE of all temperament and behavior problems. Those posters ARE criminally insane. I am running out of options. You've come to the right place for advice. Unfortunately the crate idea is not an option, she chewed through hers as well as three kennels. Thank you for your help, it is greatly appreciated. The experts you're asking have the same problems. HOWEDY MommaMia, MommaMia wrote: Please help. Seems you've already got all the information you need to know to apupriately handle and train your dog in the reply from Animal Behavior Sciences Forensic Research Laboratory. I have a female german shepard that has chewed a recliner, sofa, carpet, shoes, picture frames, games, etc. It just goes on and on. Your case history is precisely the same as that of Anthony Testa's dog Angel. He CURED her problem in WON WEEKEND. Other CASE HISTORIES show INSANT success curing separation anxiety and ALL behavior and temperament problems. Only the criminally insane posters you're asking for advice would deny the posted case history data. She has chew toys, squeaky toys, knotted ropes, but is literally chewing me out of house and home. She's tearing her insides out, as well. That's what causes 90% of all veterinary care. It's called stress induced auto-immune disease, aka The Puppy Wizard's SYNDROME. Replacements are going to cost me close to $3000.00! What can I do to stop the chewing!! Perhaps you're too grounded in your posessions? If the cup is half full or half empty, it doesn't matter as much as the sound of one hand clapping: The Sound Of One Hand Clapping When Mamiya went to the priest for personal guidance, he was asked to explain the sound of one hand clapping. Mamiya concentrated on what the sound might be. "You are not working hard enough. You are too attached to food, wealth, and to that sound. It would be better if you died. That would solve the problem." The next time Mamiya appeared before his teacher, he again was asked what he had to show regarding the sound of one hand. Mamiya immediately fell over as though dead. "You are dead, all right, but how about that sound?" Looking up, Mamiya replied: "I haven't solved that yet." "Dead men don't speak, get out!" When I am home with her, she is good as gold most of the time, Because she TRUSTS you to punish her for doin bad things to your pupperty. That's why you posted here. You've come to seek advice from like minded people who will approve of you murdering your dog. "Misery LOVES company." but when I'm not home... She GOES INSANE because you're not there warning threatening and punishing her for anxiously destroying STUFF. it's a free for all. No, she's GOING INSANE and will become DEATHLY PHYSICALLY ILL. The CAUSE? Perhaps we can blame FREE WILL. I can no longer keep her in a kennel, Your crate / kennel and corrections have CAUSED and REINFORCED her PROBLEM. she chews through the fence! Because she's AFRAID. I've been through three of them! Because you've been following the advice of like minded dog loving experts who crate bribe choke shock intimidate and murder innocent defenseless dumb critters. I am about ready to get rid of her. It's no surprise you never bothered to say "Thank You The Amazing Puppy Wizard" for providing you with the only 100% CONSISTENTLY NEARLY INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL FREE METHOD to CURE your dog's case of destructive separation anxiety as all those CASE HISTORIES he showed you proved you too, can do, if you were not having a problem which I believe is related to Munchousen By Proxy Syndrome. She is a beautiful dog, mostly black with tan paws and chest. But her beauty will only get her so far.. INDEED. It got her to The Amazing Puppy Wizard's 100% CONSISTENTLY NEARLY INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL FREE WWW Wits' End Dog Training Method Manual Forums And School Of Hard Knocks And Human Behavior Research Laboratory And Animal Behavior Sciences Forensic Research Laboratory as a STUDENT, EXAMPLE, SUBJECT, and CASE STUDY. The choice is yours. You have the FREE WILL. Your dog ONLY REACTS in PREDICTABLE NORMAL NATUARAL INNATE INSTINCTIVE REFLEXIVE WAYS to situations and circumstances of his environment which you create for him. and it almost has her in a shelter! The shelter rescue business is largely a RACKET run by other pathologically self serving dog lovers who PROFIT financially and emotionally by helping people like yourself with dogs like yours. Please help me!! The following case history will explain. Unfortunately, I couldn't research any further into your advisor's CASE HISTORY today as it's MADE ME PHYSICALLY ILL as I had been following tara o. aka tee's rearing of her dog Summer and offered to give her a permenant, safe, free, house with my family. I fear it could cause a crippling or deathly reaction were I to go further into the cause of separation anxiety, or the result of free will, any deeper at this time, today: From: "Tara O." Date: Thu, 8 Nov 2001 23:43:38 -0500 Subject: sad - "Really Stupid Is (ninnyboy) "Rocky" wrote in message . 1.4... He said that I caused Rocky's idiopathic epilepsy through abusive training. That's a lie. And libel. And impossible. This sounds very similar to me causing Summer's aggression, her separation anxiety, and her people fear by crate training her. -- Tara O. From: "Tara O." Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 08:55:53 -0500 Subject: Update I wanted to thank all of you again for your input. This boy's name was Ty, short for Tyson by the way. I sent him to the bridge yesterday. I wasn't going to although I also wasn't sure I would ever adopt him out but I wanted to give him the chance and I did NOT want to send another dog to the bridge. Two days ago when I came home from work, my house was destroyed, there were 18 piles of poop, the countertop contents were on the floor and Ty was standing there eating that day's dinner. The mess, while not pleasant to clean up wasn't a problem but I did learn that he could escape the wire crate I had him in by raising enough hell in it. That was the first day he'd been placed between two other dogs and not kept in my office space. Fancy was visibly shaken and Pebbles (Min. Dach.) was huddled in the far back corner of her crate which was moved about 3' from where it had been. I think he had intimidated my dogs but luckily they were crated. This made me wonder more about my decision to keep him in my home. Had any or all of my pets not been crated, I may have come home to more than a cleaning problem. Still though, I had his HW treatment scheduled for yesterday afternoon and I just couldn't bring myself to change the reason for the appointment. When I went home yesterday at noon to let the dogs out I had a big problem. Ty was still crated (I put him back in the plastic crate) luckily. I put my 3 plus my deaf foster out back then took Ty out front. We came back in and went to the kitchen so he could get some water. He saw the other 4 dogs outback although they didn't see him. He was fine and relaxed then started lapping up water. Suddenly and with no provocation, he bolted towards the french doors and hit them so hard that he broke them open. He was almost off the deck before I regained my footing enough to stop him. The only reason I was able to stop him was due to my never letting go of his leash but he managed to catch me totally by surprise and I'm the one who knew better than to trust his actions. I was able to get him back in and pull the door back before the deafie came lunging from the other side. I let my guard down for just a few seconds and that's what happened. Had I not had his leash still in hand, he would've gotten to my dogs for sure. I still have no idea what made him do that because he wasn't watching them and they weren't watching him so there was no provocation except their mere existence. We went to the vet and I told them that I was sending him to the bridge. While we waited outside (he couldn't be trusted inside due to other dogs in the waiting room) he was so wonderful and loving. He sat next to me and we just played for a bit. Twice I got in the car with him to leave because he was just so beautiful and wonderful with me and the other people that he met that I had a really hard time doing what I did. At least he went down in my arms while I talked to him rather than going alone in a shelter. Things like this are enough to make a person want to quit. (Quit shelter/ rescue/foster care.) -- Tara O. From: "Tara O." Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2001 00:14:04 -0400 Subject: Tara, what's happening with Summer? Thanks for thinking about us Marie and Paulette. Summer went to the bridge this evening unfortunately. Her sudden aggression grew more consistent and also turned on one adult although no injuries were sustained. I had made an appointment for Thursday to have a thyroid panel drawn and sent off to see if her aggression could've been attributable to low thyroid levels. I'd spoken with professional behaviorists, two vets, and dozens of Boxer breeders, trainers & owners. No one thought that thyroid was the cause considering that she had no other symptoms. I found that alot of Boxer owners have dogs with thyroid problems and who are on medication. The ones that became aggressive did not get better with medication unfortunately. Also, there are no studies that conclusively show that aggression is definitely related to thyroid disorders. All her other bloodwork came back normal so it seemed to be a temperament problem. Wednesday night, Amie knelt down to kiss Summer goodnight, as always, and Summer growled at her. She also tried to go after my brother-in-law on Monday. I made the extremely tough decision to send her to the bridge without waiting to test for thyroid. If she could growl at Amie then I no longer had faith that this was just a fluke. I've also come to find out that quite a few Boxers have suddenly turned aggressive between the ages of 12-24 months of age. Some of the owners of these dogs had private lifestyles that allowed them to manage the dog's behavior since visitors are infrequent. In those cases, behaviorists, rofessional trainers, and medication have been tried but have not worked. The other owners whose dogs turned were like me in that there were children around and frequent visitors in the home. They also made the same choice I did. I'm sure Jerry will go to town with this news. I've been grappling with this decision since she turned on those 2 children a few weekends ago. I had hopes that something would prove to be medically wrong with her, something that when treated, would make this behavior disappear. When she turned on my brother-in-law Monday night I began to lose what little hope I had left. When she growled at Amie two nights ago I made the decision to put her down vs. taking chances with the lives and safety of children. I took Summer to work with me today so that we could spend the time together. I took her to the vet, feeding her cheddar cubes while we waited. We played and I laughed and tried very hard not to show any anxiety or worry because I wanted her to be happy. Just before it was time for the injection, I fed her a Milky Way bar because she's always been a chocoholic. When the time came, I held her in my arms and sang 'you are my sunshine' to her while stroking her head. I've never loved any dog half as much as I loved Summer. She came in second only to Amie in my heart. This was honestly the absolute hardest thing I've ever done and wish it on no one. Hopefully Summer has the wings and halo I know she deserves. -- Tara O. From: "Tara O." Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2001 23:33:34 -0500 Subject: Separation Anxiety Move the crate to your bedroom but not when she's howling so she won't think its a reward for that behavior. She needs to feel safe and secure and she obviously doesn't any longer in the kitchen. Letting her sleep in your room should calm her because she'll be able to hear and smell you, hopefully taking a sense of security and comfort from that. Give it a few weeks then try putting her back in the kitchen if you really don't want her in your room. But for the time being, its essential for your dog's mental health, as well as physical health, that she get the sleep and peace she desperately needs. I'm sure it will also send you back to sleeping through the night as well, a much added bonus. -- Tara O. From: "Tara O." Date: Mon, 31 Mar 2003 00:28:10 -0500 Subject: SA Question "Melanie L Chang" wrote in message ... I believe that there's a lot of research into the hereditary basis of generalized anxiety. There's a colony of anxious dogs, I think at Cornell. It's a trait that can be selected for quite effectively. Since SA often goes hand-in-hand with other anxiety problems in dogs, I'd say that yes, SA can have a genetic component. This would explain why lifestyle changes and traumas can push some dogs over the edge, but others can just kind of cope with them. "Well, Jack Did Hit My Dog. Actually I'd Call It A Sharp Tap Of The Crook To The Nose. I Know Jack Wouldn't HaveDone It If He Thought Solo Couldn't Take It. I Still Crate Him Because Otherwise I Fear He Might Eat My Cat," melanie. Makes sense especially since it also effects puppies whose only change has been going from breeder to new home. Summer had it from the time I got her at 12 weeks, I know some puppy rescues who have it, and we get alot of emails from owners who can't deal with their dogs anymore due to SA and they've had them since puppyhood. While some of the problem may be due to lack of training or misuse of the term SA being applied to general destructo-dog lifestage, I do think there's an increase in the real medical problem. The 15mo I have here now has been dumped twice for SA. He just mentally freaks and can get out of both plastic and wire crates without regard for harm to himself. He goes into panic mode and can't stop. He also has some OCD behaviors. I have him on Clomicalm to assist while we undergo behavior modification. Its helping some but not a whole lot. An 8yo we have has terrible SA and has torn nails & bloodied his gums while eating through a crate. When he's loose he destroys anything he can and urinates and poops everywhere. He's also on Clomicalm at the moment and its worked wonders for him. His first owner stuck him outside at the age of 2 because they couldn't deal with the SA. He dumped at age 7, adopted from the shelter and returned 2 weeks later for the same problem. I just hate to see a dog suffering that way and am thinking that its becoming more frequent. Its also become a big cause for owner surrenders. -- Tara From: "Tara O." Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2001 14:35:39 -0400 Subject: Can't leave puppy!! Really now. I trained Summer, on my own, without medication even though it was available, with patience, hard work, and time. 6.5 months to be exact. I started her out with 10 minutes of being alone until 3 consecutive days of returning to a calm, healthy puppy & clean house were achieved. Then I'd increase the time away to 15-20 minutes. I repeated this for months until she was able to successfully, and happily, remain out of her crate and out of danger for the time that I was at work. I'd call that training. I'd call those results. Just a note to the people who are reading this. I have had JH kill-filed for a long time and I do not normally respond to his posts. I can imagine he's said horrible things about me and made absurd accusations as well. Some recent posts have been slipping through my filter and I've seen responses to Jerry's comments to my posts. I realize its futile in that he won't admit to being wrong, nor will he stop being malicious. However, I do not want the OP to think that he's right or that I'm speaking on this issue without experience. My pup may always have issues with separation anxiety but the severity of the issues and behavior related to this disorder is significantly less than it used to be. Summer threw herself into windows and doors, eliminated all over the place, tore up whatever was in the vicinity, and would be panting, panicing and shaking something fierce by the time I'd return. Now the only problem we have when I leave is that she's in her terrible twos puppy stage and is just naturally hornery, not at all attributable to SA. -- Tara O. Amie & Summer: From: "Tara O." Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 21:18:40 -0400 Subject: Summer Problems "Melanie L Chang" wrote in message ... Tara, I don't know that there's a whole lot anyone here can tell you -- at least, there isn't much I can tell you, as I've only the one case study to fall back on (Solo) and haven't seen Summer in person. There are others here more qualified to help you. That said: I strongly urge you not to fall back on medication without the supervision of a knowledgeable behaviorist. It shouldn't be prescribed to begin with without a complete evaluation looking at both behavioral and clinical parameters. In addition, it's largely useless without concomittant behavioral modification training. A behaviorist is not someone you need to go to week after week. The way my experience has gone is that we had one long initial evaluation with a detailed history taken, observation through two-way mirrors in a few different situations, observation of how I handled the dog, etc. and a clinical evaluation. We were prescribed a program including medication and a VERY detailed behavior mod protocol. We had a follow-up appointment about a month and a half later where we adjusted a few things. We haven't had an official appointment since then -- we communicate through phone calls and occasionally our behaviorist has seen us in my office, etc. more or less as a personal favor. Most behavior patients get evaluated in one or two (long) appointments and the rest is consults by phone, etc. The appointments are not cheap, but they also aren't an ongoing expense and phone consults are supposed to be free. If you want to go to a behaviorist you might be looking at a $200 or so initial expense (not including meds, if prescribed, but many psychopharm remedies are quite cheap, including Elavil) and probably not much more expense for the next several months, until you schedule a follow-up if needed. It's not a small amount of money, but it's not an impossible fee, either, and if you can find a good behaviorist, it could be well worth it. If you can't find a good behaviorist in your area, I believe that a number of well-respected clinicians will consult by phone. I don't know what's wrong with Summer, I don't know if it's analogous to what's wrong with Solo, and I don't know if anything that helped us will help you. But I found the following literature very helpful: _The Culture Clash_ by Jean Donaldson _Dogs are from Neptune_ by Jean Donaldson _The Cautious Canine_ by Patricia McConnell _How to be the Leader of the Pack_ by Patricia McConnell _Calming Signals_ by Turid Rugaas _Don't Shoot the Dog_ by Karen Pryor _Clinical Behavioral Medicine for Small Animals_ by Karen Overall (Nicholas Dodman has a couple of books out that address behavioral issues as well, but I'm not a big fan of his. However, you might like what he has to say, so it's worth taking a look.) Good luck. Thanks Melanie. I'm going to get a few of those books if I can. So far, the Boxer breeders and trainers I've talked with aren't optimistic at all and are pretty much trying to prepare more the real possibility of having to send Summer to the bridge. I can't afford a cat-scan or even a behaviorist til sometime after Christmas. Due to problems I'd rather not get into, the money situation around here is in the red for the foreseeable future. I haven't had any success with socializing her to overcome her fear of people so I know that I'm way out of my league with this new aggression issue. For all that Jerry would like to blame this on her being crated, that's not the cause. Summer hasn't been crated much at all over the last month or so. She no longer spends her days in the crate and she's not spent a night in the crate since last Christmas when she was boarded at the vet. She only goes to her crate when she wants to be alone or when she's frightened. Therefore I think its more of a safe haven than an anxiety builder. I was considering the possibility of meds, as you may recall, as a means of keeping her calm in situations where she will panic. Thereby hopefully she could learn that there's nothing to fear after a while of being calm and being near people. I was hoping that there was a medication out there that could help to keep her calm until I could afford a behaviorist and professional trainer with experience in aggression. So far, I haven't heard anything hopeful in regards to this coming from other trainers who've been there and done that. Since posting this problem on a few email lists, I've received a large number of responses from people who've had similar problems, some who've spent a small fortune on trying to find the cause and train the behavior away, all to no avail. I'm going to make an appointment for her to see the vet again this week. There's likely nothing he can tell me but I want her to have some bloodwork done, some tests, something that might indicate a physical cause. I've also joined a list for aggression in animals that has more than 100 professional aggression trainers and behaviorists, as well as vets, on board who offer advice and assistance. Maybe I'll find out something that can give me hope. Summer has been acting like her normal self on and off today. The off-times, she was withdrawn, not even wanting to play with the other dogs. Tumors, from what I've come to understand, are prevalent in Boxers. It also seems that its not so abnormal for a perfectly healthy, happy, dog to turn aggressive after a year or more of age. This pup that I have now, isn't the same pup I had just a few short months ago, and certainly not the same pup I had a year ago. She still has the fear problem, but she no longer wishes for human interaction like she used to. -- Tara O. Amie & Summer: From: "Tara O." Date: Fri, 7 Sep 2001 20:28:55 -0400 Local: Fri, Sep 7 2001 8:28 pm Subject: Escape artist Dog Jerry, couldn't you offer her sincere advice rather than using her post a your own personal attack referendum? She doesn't know any of us here so 99% of your post was lost on her. You put everybody else down, people who DO offer advice, yet you offer very little yourself. You wonder why so many people have you killfiled and call you a troll. Its behavior like this, personal attacks on other ng members, with no advice to the actual poster. The rest of us provide FREE, on the spot, advice. You offer a link to a website where someone has to place an order for your manual then wait for it to be sent to them. If your manual is free, then why not just divulge your expertise on the ng when responding to posts? -- Tara O. Amie & Summer: From: "Tara O." Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2001 23:58:15 -0400 Local: Wed, Jul 11 2001 11:58 pm Subject: Dog training "tips". I wasn't following the previous thread so I don't know what was said. However, after reading your comment, I'd like to urge you not to give up. Handing out your own advice is pretty much all you can do because the advice you're giving is based on the methods you've used. If people ask you for advice and you refuse to give it, you'd be doing a disservice to their pets IMO. Believe it or not, I've had quite a few people comment on how obedient Summer is and ask how I did it. She's not good enough to compete for an obedience title by any means but in general, I think these people are just referring to her manners. Summer was born with good manners, and a more-than-healthy does of people-fear. That is why she is so well-behaved in public. I tell people that I really can't take the credit for that but I do tell them that we went through obedience classes. I give them the name of the club, the price, and the person to contact. I make it sound like the end-all-be- all of dog training. We all know its not, the training takes place at home. However, getting these people to consider going to obedience classes, even under semi-false pretenses doesn't bother me a bit. Once they get there they'll learn more about dog behavior and how big their role is in the way their pet behaves and responds. They've already spent the money so its unlikely they'll back out of class. The way I see it is that even if they never do an ounce of training at home, the classes will at least have given the owners more insight into why their dogs do the things they do and will make them aware that its not the dog's fault. I went way off on a tangent there but I wanted to explain why when I give advice, I always promote obedience classes. I even give them more credit than they might deserve by implying that their dogs will become obedient after the course. I still dish out my own particular training techniques/corrections such as using a tin can with pennies inside to correct a bad behavior, or suggesting the use of a crate to a new puppy owner, etc. If people ask, I'll give. Hell, I even dish out my $.02 when its *not* asked for ;-) -- Tara O. Amie & Summer: From: "Tara O." Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2001 09:24:23 -0400 Subject: Cubbe and crate "Leah" -OFF wrote in message ... I am SO glad I had Madigan crate-trained... otherwise I'd be starting it from scratch right now. She was alone for 2 hours last night. Up until recently, she wouldn't do anything except maybe look for paper to shred, especially only being alone such a short period of time. However, when hubby got home, he found CDs and coasters torn to bits all over the house. She's starting to go for my shoes, too, which I've been able to leave out up until now. From now on, until she's over this new destructo-phase, she's going to be crated whenever we leave the house. My instructor said that the 11-month teething period is much worse than the 6-month. I didn't believe her. :} I send you whatever leftover patience I have then. When did I post about Summer's complete turnaround from trustworthy angel to demonic shredder? She left the paper and went to trashcan shopping and counter cruising. A few pair of shoes became casualties of her plundering, as well as a few books, toys, a plant, the bag of M&Ms, a bag of Friendship Bread Starter, and sooooo many others. That was around the 10mo period I think. She's no more trustworthy now than she was then so prepare yourself for a long wait -- Tara O. (In some cultures what I do would be considered normal.) Summer & Ami From: "Tara O." Date: Thu, 24 May 2001 16:53:43 -0400 Subject: Boxer Burgers for Dinner Again.... "Stacy Rally" wrote in message ... I don't have any advice to add, since my husband still has to call me everyday with the "damage report", so I am obviously in no place to give advice on this subject. I just wanted to comment that I think it is funny that you refer to "Boxer Burgers". I am always threatening to have "Puppy Burgers" for dinner, and my friends think that it is sick. They just don't get the humour. Of course, we never do have puppy burgers, but I'm betting that if we do, my nice, big, muscular pit bull will make a good dinner! At least she'd offset some of the damage she's done by being dinner! =3D) LOL, well anyone who knows me knows that I'd never intentionally hurt an animal, especially Summer. However, I often threaten to especially to her. I tell her that I'm gonna sell her to a vacuum cleaner salesman cuz she HATES vacuum cleaners, running or not. She huffs at me and walks away ;-) You had the two pups who were bound and determined to escape wherever you enclosed them right? How's that going? Tara O. From: "Tara O." Date: Fri, 3 Aug 2001 15:43:43 -0400 Subject: Dog house for boxer puppy? "Susan Thomas" wrote in message ... Any recommendations for a dog house for a boxer puppy? We are keeping her outside. I have looked at DogLoo II and Indigo doghouses. I know they are too large right now but I wanted to get one that the dog would be able to use when grown. Any comments/recommendations? Susan, Boxers don't like temperature changes so they don't make good outside dogs. I have a Boxer and while she may be a little more extreme than others (don't know since I haven't asked), she won't stay outside in the summer for more than the length of time it takes to sniff out a spot and go. Same thing in the winter. The only time she enjoys being outside is when the temp is between 65-75 degrees. Boxers make absolutely *wonderful* housepets. They're happy, loving, and full of laughs. They can be mischievous, just as any puppy can, but can be trained the same as any puppy. I live in a townhouse with my daughter and Summer who just turned a year old. She's not too big for the house, nor is she destructive towards anything but paper and sometimes Amie's toys, when she's not supervised. She's crate trained and sleeps in her crate while I'm at work. At night, she sleeps in my bedroom with me. She's also fully housebroken and has been since a few weeks after I got her. I'd recommend that you join one of the Boxer mailing lists on Yahoo. You can learn so much about the breed as well as hear other Boxer owner's stories of their dog's antics. I don't think you'll find one person on any of the lists who keep their babies outside all the time. Many breeders have heated and cooled kennels where the show dogs stay but the regular ol pet owners keep their dogs in the house. While I realize the choice is yours to make, I really think you'd be missing out on a wonderful companion who'll make you laugh and giggle everyday. -- Tara O. From: "Tara O." Date: Tue, 15 May 2001 22:30:14 -0400 Subject: Separation Anxiety - Long Just an update and maybe a relief-post for those who have pups with separation anxiety. As most of you know, I got Summer when she was 3 months old, straight from her outside kennel with sire, dam, 1 sis & 2 brothers. The breeder had not done any socialization with the pups and the pups had never, to my knowledge, gone inside the house. I put her in my car, drove 3 hours home with her (with a bump on her head from accidentally running into a fence post while playing). She was very withdrawn and scared but Amie & I did everything we could to love on her, make her feel welcome and safe and play...play...play with her. She went to the vet for her last puppy shots, this scared her...new people, noises, smells, etc. We got home, she began reacting violently to one of her vaccinations and we rushed her back to the vet for yet another shot. A few days later she had surgery to remove the lump on her head as it was gathering fluid & tissue and applying pressure to her skull. Again, a scary experience for a pup unused to people and indoors. I firmly believe all of this contributed to her separation anxiety. If left alone, she would panic, relieve herself, body slam doors and windows and shred anything she could get her mouth or paws on. If I were standing just outside the front door, say speaking to the mailman, she would bodyslam the door, howl and poop on the carpet, in a matter of only minutes. I have been crating Summer during the days while I'm at work for her safety as well as to protect an apartment where any property damage is grounds for eviction. She took to her crate well, never fussed about it and uses it even when we're home. When she was about 6-7 months old and had time to see that we always came back, I began leaving her out for 10 minute spaces of time each evening until I came home 3 evenings straight to no mess and a safe, happy-to-see-mommy puppy. I then increased the time away to roughly 20 minutes, repeating the same 3-day rule. Each time I worked her up going almost double the time. I am happy to report that after 3 months of working on this, Summer doing the all of the work, today marks the 3rd day in a row that Summer was left out of her crate for the entire workday. She doesn't leave the window according to my neighbors. Each time I pull up, she's on the couch, with her face pressed to the window and won't get down til she hears my key in the door. We then have 15 minutes of 'good girl', rolling on the floor, tummy-rubs, etc. before she goes outside to do her thing. I am sooooooooo proud of my little girl. While I only had to provide the patience, she had to do all the hard work and deal with her fear. She did it !!!! I know this is very long and I apologize but I thought for anyone who be having similar problems, they could see that there can be a light at the end of the tunnel and I thought details would help. -- Tara O. From: "Tara O." Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 19:27:44 -0400 Subject: Advice to Newbies "Leah" -OFF wrote in message ... Keep believing Jerry Howe. :} She is neither out of control, a lunger, or a biter. She's made a lot of progress on the leash now that I'm using a clicker and a GL. Yes, she did bite me once, and that was entirely my fault. This last time I only posted because it was a funny story. She didn't *bite* me. She was chewing on her bone, and I had my finger in the way. She was more upset about it than I was. Leah, don't bother, no amount of reiteration will work. According to Jerry, I'm not qualified to give an opinion on anything since Summer *was* a problem pup but the fact that she no longer suffers from SA doesn't count for anything, nor the fact that I trained her out of it on my own and without meds. Kinda reminds me of the tabloid people. You know, how no matter what a person does that's good, they always manage to publish something bad that happened 10 years ago just because its more sensational than showing and telling the truth. -- Tara O. Amie & Summer: From: "Tara O." Date: Sat, 13 Oct 2001 22:13:39 -0400 Subject: Summer Problems I believe I now have a pup that's become fear-aggressive, possibly just flat-out aggressive. If you all remember my posting the 'mentally slow' account a week or so ago, I related my worry over her having become withdrawn. This is getting worse. I wish that were the only problem at the moment but unfortunately its not. Yesterday we were at DH's house and one of Amie's friends came over. This little 6yo boy has been coming over for as long as Summer has been visiting there. IOW, Summer has seen him and even played with him for about 6 months now, on a regular basis. After this boy (Sully....not Sully the dog) was in the house, he and Amie were in the hallway getting ready to enter her room. All the sudden, Summer lunged and snapped at him, thank GOD she didn't actually get hold of him. I was standing right there and saw the whole thing. Sully wasn't even looking at her, let alone doing anything to provoke such an attack. Summer was scolded and crated and Sully soothed, although I give the boy credit for giving me a weak smile and shrugging saying 'I wasn't scared.' Today Summer was in the backyard with the other 3 dogs when the neighbor out back came outside to do yardwork. She commenced to lunging, snapping, growling, and barking at the fence, trying to get to him. I immediately brought her in the house after giving her a firm 'NO' then locking her in the crate for a time-out. About 15 minutes later, I let her out and she was just walking around the house. Amie's best friend, a little girl named Cadie, knocked at the door to play and Summer ran to the door, took one look at her, then lunged and snapped at her, luckily there was glass in place! She was crated again for close to 4 hours because Cadie was there, then Sully came as well, plus the guy out back was still doing yardwork. As you all know, Summer has never been aggressive except for the time that kid was taunting the dogs from outside the fence. Given her gradual withdrawal from me and Amie, and now this aggressive behavior, I'm very worried. The vet had said she was physically fit so I don't think there's anything causing this other than a mental/behavioral problem although that seems like too light a word to describe what's going on. Due to events in the last 3 days, I'm broke, and can't afford a behaviorist for the next few months at least. I'm going to request medication for her and hopefully that will help. If this new aggression isn't fear or anxiety based though, I don't know that medication will help. I haven't been able to train her out of her people-fear with all the socialization I could give her over the last year. I don't think I can train this aggression away by myself either. I hate to think of the consequences if medication and future training by someone doesn't work. In a household with a 6yo, 3 other dogs, a constant flux of other children and adults coming and going, I can't have an aggressive dog. She'd have to be crated constantly. I'm probably overreacting about the future right now but having a dog that attacks would be irresponsible of me, considering the kind of life I have and that there are small children present. For all that I sound as if I have no hope, don't think that I'm giving up on her. If the time ever comes that she can't be helped, she won't be rehomed. She wouldn't do well with strangers and the alternative is one that I don't want to think of. Does anyone have a different take on this than mine? -- Tara O. Amie & Summer:. From: "Tara O." Date: Thu, 24 May 2001 21:00:09 -0400 Subject: Boxer Burgers for Dinner Again.... "J1Boss" wrote in message ..=2E Adolescence. Molars :setting: in the jaw - a very typical age to "test". No big surprises here except why you let her continue to fail over several days. The first day I figured it was just a fluke and that since my daughter had been at her father's house in those shoes (he has a lab puppy & our mini. dachshund) that maybe the other dog's smell was strong on the shoe. IOW, I gave her the benefit of doubt. The second day (yesterday) I was surprised and thought maybe she got or bored or agititated. I brought out an extra toy for her to have and left the house this morning, giving her a treat as I go, like normal. I knew that if she messed up today that it was a new behavior problem. I didn't want to go back to crating her so fast without giving her the benefit of doubt. Given her previously suffered anxiety disorder, Summer has been crated while I work since I brought her home. Its taken months on end of building her out-of-crate time when I'm not home to being all day. She just achieved that goal last month and did fine until this week. I didn't want to jump the gun by re-crating her so instead I gave her an extra day (2 if you count the 1st day shoe episode). Before giving her that freedom again, make sure you have a plan to do it in small steps and set her up for success (not so much free space!). At this age, some dogs can handle it, some dogs can't. Believe me, we've been working incremental 'out-times', building her up from 15-minute increments to the final all-day for months. I'm saddened that we must go back to square one after finally overcoming her separation anxiety. A note here for anyone who might think this behavior is related to the anxiety. Never before was she destructive to things on tables, desks, counters, etc. She would body slam the door and window, pant, growl, eliminate, etc. when she suffered a panic attack. This destruction is very much puppy-type destruction and not at all similar to what I'd see when she had anxiety. Backpeddle a bit, focus on "structure" for her every day life (as well as training sessions) and in another week (on a weekend!) give it a try for an hour or so. She needs to earn the freedom. Well after today that is the plan. We are currently in obedience training classes once a week. I work with her for anywhere from 30 minutes to an hour a day (broken down into 15 minute sessions). I walk her twice a day and take her for car rides almost everyday. My schedule or routine rarely ever varies so I've been able to create the structure she's needed. I know better than to do otherwise after having dealt with her separation anxiety and poor socialization. I've just never seen one of the other puppies I've raised backslide at this age. They have become obnoxious but have grown out of their 'tear em up' phase. Summer seems to be working backwards. Thanks Janet, Tara O. From: "Tara O." Date: Thu, 24 May 2001 15:56:56 -0400 Subject: Boxer Burgers for Dinner Again.... After that oh so long post from last week on Summer's wonderful progress on being left free to roam the house all day while I'm at work, the stink-bomber has gone and contradicted me. Two days ago I came home to a shredded shoe and lovely claw digs in my very expensive cherry tables (she was using them as launching pads from what I can ascertain). Yesterday, I came home to a plant torn apart, a cup on the floor (that was sitting next to the sink), another shoe torn up, and the phone book in a not-so-readable condition. Today I went home for lunch and the living room & kitchen were trashed. She took books off my desk and shredded them (one of them being The Count of Monte Cristo...not as old an edition as Matt's). She snatched the bills to be paid out of my bill holder and shredded them too. She managed to get the coat closet door open (must not have caught when I pushed it shut this morning) and proceeded to tear up yet another shoe, 2 of Amie's new barbie dolls, a hair clip, and a water gun (all were in a little play bag Amie had put in there). She is crated at the moment while I'm back at work. Summer has NEVER chewed on anything but her bones and an occasional small toy from Amie's room. She's never bothered our shoes, stolen things from the counters or been destructive in any other way towards our belongings.... except for the plants when she was young and scared of being alone. Now why would a pup who has been a perfect angel for her 7 months with us, suddenly become destructive? Nothing has changed. My hours are the same. I go home everyday for an hour at lunch and let her out & play with her. Her food is the same, she still has all her toys, bones, etc. I just don't get it. I spoke with her at length about this before coming back to work and she put me in my place quite efficiently. She looked at me, farted the most gawd-awful smelling thing ever to haunt mankind, then she walked into the next room and ignored my existence. I know she's a pup but my other puppies have always been destructive first and worked out of it. They didn't go for 7 months of being non-destructive, well-behaved angel's to demons from dogdom. Any ideas? Tara O. From: "Tara O." Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 22:20:07 -0400 Subject: Worried about Summer Well, I left yesterday for Florida. Amie's dad came and got her & the crate (she went with him willingly). He called me shortly after to say that he couldn't get Summer in the crate so I needed to go by on my way out to lock her up. I did that and she wasn't very happy about it. Her crate was facing Sully's (water-pawing puppy) so they were able to see each other. I thought she'd be okay. I called first thing this morning to check on her and he said that last night, he couldn't get her back in the crate without physically putting her there which he didn't do. He didn't want to freak her out. He said that she wouldn't come near him, not even for a treat. He's been the only person to date that she's totally accepted and wiggles & kidney-beans for. I just chalked it up to her being upset that I wasn't there too. I came home today and he brought her back to me. She wouldn't come near me. When I speak to her she turns her head away. If I try to approach her she runs away from me. She's now been home for 3 hours and still won't come near me. She won't even go outside to potty. I'm really worried that I just set her back big time with her separation anxiety. Normally I'd think she is mad at me (I know, some of you don't think dogs can get mad). But she won't even eat or go outside. Any input would be greatly appreciated -- Tara O. From: "Tara O." Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 22:21:22 -0400 Subject: Worried about Summer I forgot to add that she also won't go near Amie or allow Amie to approach or touch her either so its not just me. -- Tara O. From: (misty) Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 14:07:14 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Worried about Summer Tara O. wrote: I came home today and he brought her back to me. She wouldn't come near me. When I speak to her she turns her head away. If I try to approach her she runs away from me. She's now been home for 3 hours and still won't come near me. She won't even go outside to potty. I'm really worried that I just set her back big time with her separation anxiety. Normally I'd think she is mad at me (I know, some of you don't think dogs can get mad). But she won't even eat or go outside. Any input would be greatly appreciated. Cindy wrote: That doesn't sound like separation anxiety but something else. (With SA, you never [at least IME] get a dog *ignoring* you, it's always the other extreme.) Sounds like either fear or pain. If fear, I'd give her some time, if pain, I'd have a vet check her over. That's an odd one, keep us posted. --Cindy I thought the main components of separation anxiety were stress and fear? Summer has been stressed out, was fearful of the crate, and fearful of Tara's ex. I can understand Summer's avoidance of her favorite people in this way. If a dog has been "punished", it will act fearful, use avoidance and/or aggressive towards whomever or whatever it perceives as the "punisher". Perhaps Summer feels like she has been "punished" by being separated from her pack and is fearful of further "punishment". I interpret this from using time-outs with my kids, they hate being sent away from us (sent to their room). ~Misty~ =B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B 3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3= =B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B 3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3= =B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3=B3 From: "Tee" Date: Sun, 25 Apr 2004 22:54:22 -0400 Subject: Feeding in crate--good or bad idea? "Marie" wrote in message e.rogers.com... Macula still seems to consider the crate , at any time other than bedtime, as evil exile. She will not touch bones, kongs, etc., I think because she's stressed- -barking in a high pitched tone. I'm thinking about moving her food dish into the crate. In addition to (hopefully) making the crate more palatable, this may have other pluses: the location of her dish right now always attracts ants in the summer, and right now the food dish is a magnet for the rugrats whenever they are on the floor in this room. The potential downsides are that the crate is closer to the nursery, and therefore possibly even more accessible: and the crate is in our bedroom, which is carpeted, and I worry about how much mess might be made and the possibility of ants and other ickies invaded the bedroom. Do any of you feed in the crate? Does it work? Will this make things better for Macula, do you think? Does Macula need to be in the crate? I feed in the crate when I have a new foster dog but that's the only time. If ants & kidlets are a problem, put the bowl up on top of the crate, or the counter. This won't work well if you're free- feeding but it'll work to help ween her onto scheduled feedings. Like feeding her when you fee the kids. They're probably in high chairs so they can't bother her or the food. I don't have any advice on getting a reluctant dog to accept the crate after long-term attempts. All the dogs I've had have taken to crating right away. With the exception of two who had severe confinement anxiety, all the others not only go in quietly but they nap in their crates at every opportunity. In this aspect, my breed is easy. -- Tara From: "Tara O." Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 16:37:36 -0400 Subject: Worried about Summer "Cindy" wrote in message ... Is Summer on any kind of medication? She sounds like a candidate for trying some of them out to see the effect. No she's not. We had done so well on our own with the timed absences over 6 months that the vet and I wanted to see if we could bring her out of her anxiety naturally. It did work as most of you will recall when a few months ago we'd finally worked up to her being alone during the workday, outside of her crate, with excellent results. Then of course about 3 weeks ago she hit the terrible twos and is being crated again. As an update...she's a little better today although not much. She slept, curled in a ball under the table, all evening yesterday. She still hadn't eaten, drank or gone outside by 11pm when I went to bed. She was non-responsive to my efforts at getting her to play, although she would wake up and just look at me. I checked her over for any physical signs of ailment and there were none. My husband swears that nothing out of the ordinary happened. She had her own food, water, played well with his lab puppy, but just wouldn't come near him. He left her to herself since he didn't want to force her to endure attention she obviously didn't want. Anyway, sometime last night she came upstairs and went to sleep under my bed which is her preferred place to sleep at night. This morning she came downstairs with me and went outside although she still wouldn't play with me, or with any of her toys. She slept again for about 3 hours then I was able to get her to drink. Still no food though. I don't think the poor pup slept a wink from the time I left her Saturday morning until she came home at 7 last night sigh. She's no longer running away from me luckily. She is however only tolerating my touch. She won't wag her nub, no wiggling, no playing, etc. Oh, another weird thing she did last night was to leave the table and paw at her crate door til I opened it. She then went inside and curled herself into a ball. She did it again this morning after coming in from pottying. I have to wonder if she thinks that she's done something very wrong. Or if she no longer trusts me not to leave her for good. That's why I was worried about the separation anxiety. Maybe it was so extreme, although not physically apparent, that she's begun to fear me or lost whatever security she felt with me. Her use of the crate has always been there, but not to the extent that she's scrunching herself up in the back of it. If I didn't know Scott inside and out I'd really think something bad happened to her. But he is and always has been a huge dog lover, and he's always adored Summer. I just don't know what to think. The vet said that if she continues in her self-imposed fast, that I should bring her in tomorrow or Wednesday depending on my instincts. Since I know what food she ate, where she stayed, and who was around her, we both feel that a physical problem is problem not likely. -- Tara O. From: "Tara O." Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 16:44:17 -0400 Subject: Worried about Summer "misty" wrote in message ... I thought the main components of separation anxiety were stress and fear? Summer has been stressed out, was fearful of the crate, and fearful of Tara's ex. You know, its strange that she'd fear him because she's known him since we brought her home. My ex and I are still very close and he comes by the house quite often. We've lately been spending alot of time at his house, Summer included, since we're trying to work out our differences. She has always (well after about 2 months of seeing him) adored him. She begs him to play with her, for attention, etc. She has spent a good bit of time at his house playing with his pup and our miniature dachshund so the surroundings were also familiar to her. She was definitely afraid though according to him and to her behavior since last night. I wasn't there with her so that must be the reason, although I don't understand why she's shunning me now. Perhaps Summer feels like she has been "punished" by being separated from her pack and is fearful of further "punishment". I think there is some truth to this since she is hiding in her crate as if that's the only place she's allowed to be. Her crate is her home beyond a doubt, its her safe haven, but there have been times that she's been put in her crate for bad behavior. More so to keep me from screaming at her than to teach her a lesson so she does associate the crate to some extent as a place where I put her when she's been bad. -- Tara O. From: "Tara O." Date: Sun, 1 Apr 2001 22:00:06 -0400 Subject: Separation Anxiety For those of you who may have seen my previous post a while back on Summer suffering from SA and being crated when I'm not home and asleep, I have an update... I let her stay out Friday night when I went to bed, hoping that her need to keep me awake and moving had magically disappeared...she did ok, only woke me up 6 times in 4 hours (this is a progress). I put her in her crate around 5am because I really needed some uninterrupted sleep. Saturday night I did the same thing and she only woke me up 3 times in about 4 hours....that's a 50% reduction! She did however willing come downstairs to her crate after she realized I wasn't getting up. I also left her alone in the house yesterday. I've been working her alone time up from 10 minutes to 15 minutes and that seemed to be pushing it. Well yesterday I left her alone to run to the grocery store, planning to be gone for about 20 minutes. Someone who, had I seen her coming I would've left my groceries and bolted out the door, I used to work with spotted me and wanted to give me the long version of her life story for the last 5 years. I ended up not getting home til an hour and 15 minutes after I'd left (lines were backed up at the registers too, go figure). Amie and I walked in the door and to what did our wondering eyes behold??? A CLEAN HOUSE AND A SAFE DOG!!!!!! She did it! I think it had something to do with working with her the previous nights, getting her used to being "alone" even when I'm physically present. I'm so proud of her! Amie and I left the groceries in the car and immediately took Summer out for a walk so she could socialize and get out of the house. Since she loves her walks, that was the best way I could think of to praise her besides all the verbal praise she got. I remembered the milk & eggs about 2 hours later, sitting out there in the trunk lol. Anyways, I think we're on track and together, we're making great progress. My goal is to be able to leave her unattended for the entire day that I'm at work and have her not be afraid or anxious. I'm shooting for July 1st. Thanks for listening. -- Tara O. HOWEDY tara o. aka tee, Tee wrote: I have an Innotek IUT-300 UltraSmart remote trainer in hand. IT AIN'T GONNA MAKE YOU SMART, tara o. aka tee. The collar itself goes on today but will not be used for several days as I don't want him to make a collar association if possible. Oh goody! You DID get WIZE to the "collar conditioning". CuriHOWES AIN'T IT, that NOWON HERE HAS EVER MENTIONED collar conditioning OTHER THAN The Amazing Puppy Wizard {); ~ ) , and YOU DON'T READ HIS POSTS... On Saturday That's TODAY! HURRAY! I'm going to set him up to fail so I can use the collar and provide him with a few clear associations. Ahhh. Joe Joe knows, without doubt, that counter-cruising and trash-raiding are unacceptable. I'm going to intentionally put something yummy on the counter and make myself visibly scarce. I know he'll take the bait. I plan to tone him for approaching/thinking about the food and stimulate him for touching the food. Oh. GOOD IDEA! THAT'LL WIZE HIM UP TO THE COLLAR. BWEEEEEEEEEAHAHAHHAHAAA!!! Same with the trashcan and I plan to do this until Monday. You mean, till you BURN him on Monday. HE WON'T GO NEAR THEM WHILE YOU'RE WATCHIN so YOU WON'T BE ABLE TO BURN HIM, tara o. aka tee. BWEEEEEEEEEEEEEAAHAHAHHAHHAAA!!! The way I see it is that I'm taking something I know he has made a "this is NOT allowed" association with and providing a nick to accompany it. You mean a SHOCK, tara o. aka tee. Let's not get TOO technical. This way when the marking behavior is addressed he will hopefully: a) not make a collar association You mean with the collar that's been "toning" him for a couple days. b) know that the correction is a result of THE RESULT OF YOU HURTIN HIM. him doing something inappropriate Dogs EAT STUFF when they're anXXXIHOWES and INSECURE, JUST LIKE HOWE YOU DO, with your bulemia and STUFF. REMEMBER? I have someone local coming by Monday evening just to meet Joe Joe and try to figure out the best, least risky in terms of possible negative side associations, way to handle identifying & association marking Fancy. Ahhh. EXXXCELLENT! We wouldn't want someWON who DON'T KNOW HOWE to PUPPERLY HURT a dog to mess IT up by shockin IT a the wrong time. I have websites from Dobbs, Castle, Tritronics and various retriever related ecollar articles bookmarked as well as some research I did into the archives for conversations between Lynn, Amy, Susan F, Trisha, etc. BWEEEEEEEEEAAHAHHAHAAA!!! ALL THE DOG ABUSERS WHO DON'T POST HERE ABHOWETS nodoGamenedMOORE, eh tara o. aka tee? You certainly DID NOT SEE any "COLLAR CONDITIONING" advice in The Amazing Puppy Wizard's Archives that DIDN'T COME FROM The Amazing Puppy Wizard. I plan to see if I can find a book or two on e-collar training at Barnes & Noble this afternoon. Hopefully my efforts in this direction and correct use of the tool You mean PAIN FEAR and INTIMDIATION. will provide the fix we're searching for. Well tara o. aka tee, the FIX AIN'T GONNA HAPPEN on accHOWENT of as you REPRESS ANXXXIHOWESNESS BEHAVIORS those behaviors CHANGE to OTHER, often worse, seemingly UNRELATED behaviors, like attackin innocent critters and havin halucinations and OCD behaviors. I hope it also calms any fears some of you seem to have about me using an e-collar. HOWE COME you didn't give THIS OPPORTUNITY to your own DEAD DOG Summer pryor to MURDERIN her? It seems to me the best tool for the job You mean HURTIN him. at this point and that it may be foolish to not try it. And THAT'S HOWE COME you're BOXER RESCUE of NC. -- Tara HOWEDY tara o. aka tee, Tee wrote: "Rocky" wrote in message ... At this point, I'd worry less about the *later* than I would about the *now*. BWEEEEEEEEEEEAHAHAHAHHAHHAAAA!!! CuriHOWES AIN'T IT HOWE you got a case of DOMINANCE PISSIN JUST LIKE HOWE professora melanie's dog Skeeter got, for the same same same same REASON, tara o. aka tee. You punk thug coward mental cases HURT and INTIMIDATE your dogs and make them GO MENTAL JUST LIKE YOURESELVES. Perhaps it's allelomimetic behavior? As you said in another post, if this problem isn't solved soon, The PROBLEM is that tara o. aka tee JERKS CHOKES BRIBES CRATES and INTIMDIATES her dog JUST LIKE HOWE professora melanie done to her DOMINANCE PEEIN Papilion Skeeter {); ~ ) Joe Joe has to leave. Seems there's a lotta THAT goin arHOWEND amongst HOWER RESCUE DOG LOVERS {): ~ ) What makes you MENTAL CASES think you can play hide the weenie with dogs swapping them in and HOWET of HOWESES and NOT EXXXPECT them to BE FEARFUL of their new abuser? I'd be looking at aversions now. You mean HURT the dog, matty, on accHOWENT of you don't know HOWE to pupperly handle and train a dog or your own dog wouldn't be DYIN of PSYCHOGENIC SEIZURES, matty. I'm using aversions now INDEED. PERHAPS THAT'S HOWE COME the dog is ANXXXIHOWES and AGGRESSIVE towards the other dog whom he's already fought with? by always supervising and yelling THAT'S HOWE COME YOUR DOGS ARE AFRAID AND HOWETA CON-TROLL. YOU'RE MENTAL CASES... THE WHOWEL DAMNED BUNCH OF YOU. when I see him lift his leg near her. BWEEEEEEEEEEEAAAHAHAHHAHHAHAAA!!! THE FIRST RULE OF AVERSIVE TRAININ IS: YOU GOT TO HURT THE DOG ENOUGH EVERY TIME TILL THE BEHAVIOR IS EXXXTINGUISHED OR YOU'LL VARIABLY REINFORCE THE BAD BEHAVIOR. Ask dr sidman or professor SCRUFF SHAKE dermer or his punk thug coward dog abusing pal dr mark plonsky of UofWI {); ~ ) BWEEEEEEAAHAHAHAHHAHAAA!!! He stops and comes to me immediately THAT'S SUBMISSIVE BEHAVIOR, tara o. aka tee. Your dog is AFRAID OF YOU JUST LIKE HOWE you MADE YOUR OWN DEAD DOG Summer FEAR AGGRESSIVE of small children despite that she was RAISED with them. but sometimes I'm too late THAT'S HOWE COME AVERSIVES FAIL. BWEEEEEEEEEAAHAHAHAHHHAAAA!!! or his body language doesn't indicate that he's about to approach and pee on Fancy. Oh yeah, the BODY LANGUAGE. HOWE was your DEAD DOG Summer's BODY LANGUAGE when you shoved the cheddar and chocolate in her head and MURDERED HER DESPITE that The Amazing Puppy Wizard offered her a SAFE PERMENANT FREE HOWES FOREVER where she'd NEVER BE HURT and INTIMDATED like HOWE you done to her, tara o. aka tee. I do praise him when he potties, BWEEEEEEEEAAHAHAHAHHAHAAA!!! You're in your element, eh tara. just as I do Fancy, because when I witness it habit dictates that I praise "good dog go potty" in my very happy voice. BWEEEEEEEEEEAAHAHAHHAHAAA!!! Since I'm supervising outdoor times now Oh, so NHOWE you CAN HURT HIM EVERY TIME. I've been witness to all such events. But you wasn't ABLE to HURT him sometimes. Having spent the last two weeks interrupting him You mean, INTIMIDATING him. with no noticable cure in sight IN FACT, his BAD BEHAVIOR has INCREASED to CONSTANTLY as a DIRECT RESULT of YOU ABUSING YOUR DOGS, tara o. aka tee {); ~ ) I am trying to find another alternative. ANY behavior that's CONSISTENT REPEATABLE or PREDICTABLE is EZ to EXXXTINGUISH NEARLY INSTANTLY so long as you AIN'T HURTING INTIMDIATING BRIBING and AVOIDING the PROBLEM {); ~ ) Joe Joe may get yelled at THAT'S HOWE COME HE'S ANXXXHOWES AND PISSIN AND ATTACKING. which he doesn't like at all SHAZAM? and will cower easily) Oh? You mean JUST LIKE HOWE matty's dog cowers. and easily call off On accHOWENT of YOU INTIMDIATE him. but its not a lasting impression, On accHOWENT of YOU DIDN'T HURT HIM LIKE THE LAST TIME. You ever heard of CONSISTENCY? If you want PAIN FEAR FORCE and INTIMDATION to WORK YOU GOTTA KNOW HOWE TO HURT FORCE and INTIMDATE PUPPERLY or you'll REINFORCE the BAD BEHAVIOR, dog lovers {); ~ ) THAT'S HOWE COME YOU CAN'T TRAIN YOUR DOGS USING PAIN. YOU CAN'T HURT SOME DOGS ENOUGH SO YOU GOT TO MURDER THEM. or he chooses to continue the behavior On accHOWENT of he's FRANTICK. You dog is DYING from STRESS. He's PISSSIN HIS GUTS HOWET. the same as the dogs know the trashcan is off- limits but they choose to raid it anyway. Oh? THAT'S ON ACCHOWENT OF YOU TRY TO FORCE BRIBE and INTIMDATE and AVOID the PROBLEM, dog lovers. Takes minutes to break a dog of garbage eatin or C-HOWENTER surfin no matter HOWE long IT been doin THAT {); ~ ) But you can't do that if you bribe hurt intimdiate and avoid. I really don't think he's connecting peeing on Fancy to anything. Of curse not, on accHOWET of you don't know what you're talkin abHOWET or you wouldn't HURT and INTIMDIATE your dogs from the git go. WOULD YOU. BWEEEEEEEAHAHAHAHHAHAAA!!! Today I had the dogs out due to a need to vacate for an exterminator. I had both dogs on one leash with a coupler because I can't handle two leashes with him pulling like freight train (with a pinch collar on). The dog PULLS on accHOWENT of HE'S AFRAID of your pronged spiked pinch choke collar YOU use to CHOKE HIM. One of the incidents occured in an outdoor mall. You shouldn't touch livin critters, tara o. aka tee. Your own daughter is on ANTI PSYCHOTIC meds in 1st grade. We were walking down the pavement when Fancy sidled to the left to sniff a bush. Suddenly and without even looking at her Joe Joe lifted his left leg and started peeing on her. You should PRAISE HIM and HE'LL STOP. One second he was walking and the next he was peeing on Fancy. There was no visible warning. BWEEEEEEEEAAHAHAHAHHHAAAA!!! THAT'S VARIABLE REINFORCEMNT, tara o. aka tee. Walking back to the car took us through a treed area where I purposely walked them through in hopes of giving them time to potty if they needed to. The dog is MARKING. THAT MEANS HE GOT NO NEED TO "POTTY." He's doin it from ANXXXIHOWESNESS {); ~ ) Joe Joe made two different attempts to lift his leg on Fancy. Was you ABLE to HURT him PRYOR to STARTIN? IF NOT, you're VARIABLY REINFORCING BAD BEHAVIORS... Once they were just walking, no trees, bushes or sniffing happening and the other was when she stopped, turned to look at me and he turned, looked directly at her, then sidled next to her and started to lift his leg. UNLESS YOU WAS ABLE TO HURT HIM EACH TIME, AND UNLESS YOU'RE ABLE TO HURT HIM EVERY TIME, YOU'RE VARIABLY REINFORCING THE BAD BEHAVIOR. EACH TIME YOU DO SO MAKES IT HARDER TO BREAK. Then an hour later we were at the park, walking the trails, when Fancy was on the left and stopped to sniff a bush. Joe Joe attempted to sniff the bush as well, from behind Fancy, walked up along side her then got immediately called off as I just knew what he was thinking. So, you're sayin you MISSED the last two TRAINING OPPORTUNITIES and PUNISHED him on the third repetition. BWEEEEEEEEAAHAHAHAHHAHAAA!!! THAT'S MAKE YOUR DOG GO INSANE, like your own DEAD DOG Summer. Wait??? YOUR DOG ALREADY IS INSANE, or he wouldn't be DOIN THIS. He looked at me, put the leg down, THAT TAUGHT HIM TO DO THE BEHAVIOR ONLY WHEN YOU CAN'T CATCH HIM, tars o. aka tee. You better up your ANTI PSYCHOTIC MEDS. sat like a good boy, then stood & urinated on her anyway. Seems your dog knows you're dumber than dirt, eh tara. I don't think it was defiance BWEEEEAHAHAHAHHAHAA!!! YOUR DOG IS TELLIN YOU TO GO **** YOURSELF, tara o. aka tee. so much as he was interrupted "INTERRUPTED"??? HE PISSED ON HER ANYHOWE RIGHT IN FRONT OF YOU JUST AS SOON AS YOU STOPPED INTIMIDATING HIM SOMEMOORE. but as soon as the interruption passed, You mean the INTIMIATION that makes him so ANXXXIHOWES. and he wasn't sure what the interruption was about, YOU BEEN HURTIN AND INTIMDIATING HIM FOR TWO WEEK FOR THE SAME PROBLEM, tara o. aka tee. YOU couldn't HURT your dog three HOWETA FOUR TIMES HE DONE IT and THEN when you CAUGHT HIM HE TOLD YOU TO F' OFF. BWEEEEEEAAHAHAHAHAHAA!!! THAT MEANS YOU GOTTA HURT HIM SOMEMOORE, tara o. aka tee. he went back to his business. The BUSINESS of throwin you the dew claw... BWEEEEEEEEEAHAHAHHAAHAA!!! At home, not an hour later, in the backyard, he peed on her again but I didn't see that one. YOU'LL NEVER EXXXTINGUISH A BEHAVIOR IF YOU CAN'T HURT THE DOG EVERY TIME HE DOES BAD, you freakin MENTAL CASE. I'd just opened the door when UPS arrived and I had to run out front to sign for something. It took about 2 minutes total of being unsurpervised that time. BWEEEEEEAHAHAHAHHHAAAA!!! THAT'S HOWE COME AVERSIVES DON'T WORK, dog lovers. AVERSIVES ONLY WORK IN A LABORATORY SETTING. BWEEEEEEEEEAAHAHAHAHHAHAAA!!! LIKE RIGHT HERE, on The Amazing Puppy Wizard's FREE WWW Wits' End Dog Training Method Forums and SCHOOL Of HARD KNOCKS and HUMAN BEHAVIOR RESEARCH LABORATORY {); ~ ) WELCOME, LABORATORY SUBJECTS! Sometimes its just her he pees on for seemingly no good reason. Duh? HE'D RECENTLY FOUGHT WITH HER for which YOU INTIMIDATED him someMOORE {); ~ ) Sometimes it appears to be overmarking. BWEEEEEEEEAAHHAHAHHAHAHAAA!!! DOGS ARE CONSISITENT, tara o. aka tee, UNLIKE you dog "trainers." Sometimes he looks and sometimes he doesn't Even the DOG knows where his tallywhacker is, tara o. aka tee. but I'm pretty sure he always *knows* what he's doing. UNLIKE YOURSELVES. Using an electronic collar, Will probably make him attack the other dog, tara o. aka tee. THEN YOU CAN MURDER IT JUST LIKE HOWE YOU DONE YOUR OWN DEAD DOG Summer on accHOWENT of you COULDN'T STOP HURTING and INTIMDIATING and LOCKING IT IN A BOX. something I was considering purchasing anyway To HURT and INTIMDIATE your BOXER RESCUE of NC dogs, tara o. aka tee {); ~ ) for other reasons, On accHOWENT of YOU CAN'T TRAIN YOUR DOGS. would still require my supervision Duh? Perhaps you can put a sensor in his diaper to burn his tallywhacker when he tries it again? because I'd have to see him in his approach You mean HURT your dog someMOORE, tara o. aka tee. THAT's HOWE COME HE'S DOIN IT, tara o. aka tee. You know HOWE tricky that BODY LANGUAGE is... he even DONE IT RIGHT IN FRONT OF YOU as you was INTIMIDATIN him someMOORE. REMEMBER? THEN HE DONE IT AGAIN AND AGAIN. REMEMBER? YOUR METHOD AIN'T WORKIN and shockin the dog AIN'T gonna make him FEEL SAFE and HAPPY, tara o. aka tee. in order to issue a correction. My issues with this are threefold. BWEEEEEEEEEAHAHAHAHHAHAAA!!! First, I don't want him to mistake the correction Not to worry, tara o. aka tee. HE AIN'T GONNA MISTAKE NUTHIN. or not understand it at all He'll UNDERSTAND you're HURTIN him for bein near the other dog and he'll TRY to MURDER HER on accHOWENT of YOU HURTIN HIM for bein near her. and its my current opinion that he's not understanding why I call him off. Oh? WHAT DOES THAT MATTER? If you can EXXXTINGUISH a BEHAVIOR the dog DON'T GOT TO UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU CAN'T TELL HIM, tara o. aka tee. All your pain fear force and intimidation TELLS HIM is that YOU'RE A DOG ABUSING MENTAL CASE who HURTS and INTIMDIATES and won't hesitate to MURDER HIM JUST LIKE HOWE you done your own DEAD DOG Summer DESPITE that The Amazing Puppy Wizard offereed her a SAFE FREE HOWES FOREVER where she'd NEVER be HURT and INTIMDIATED like HOWE you do to your fear aggressive hyperactive pissers. You couldn't even HOWEsbreak your Daxie. He obeys No, he's MOMENTARILY INTIMDIATED, which is HOWE COME he ANXXXHOWESLY DOMINANCE PISSES JUST LIKE HOWE professora melanie's dog Skeeter does... FOR THE SAME SAME SAME SAME REASON... YOU HURT YOUR DOGS. BWEEEEEEAHAHAHHAAA!!! but he doesn't seem to get the *why* of it On accHOWENT of it's a OBSESSIVE COMPULSIVE ANXXXIHOWESNESS BEHAVIOR that HE CAN'T CON-TROLL other than to DO IT WHEN YOU AIN'T WATCHIN on accHOWENT of you'll HURT HIM someMOORE. REMEMBER NHOWE? and I am unsure about how to drive that point home. YOU CAN'T. You got to KNOW HOWE to modify behavior using NON PHYSICAL CON-DITIONING but you AIN'T GOT THE INTELLECT to HOWEtwit the cunning of the domestic puppy dog even AFTER The Amazing Pupy Wizard and HIS 100% CONSISTENTLY NEARLY INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL FREE WWW Wits' End Dog Training Method Manual Students ALL OVER The WHOWEL WILD WORLD TOLD YOU HOWE THEY DONE IT EZ GENTLY NEARLY INSTANTLY and FOR FREE, to boot {); ~ ) BUT YOU PREFER TO HURT INTIMDIATE and MURDER innocent critters. Secondly, I don't want to indefinitely supervise these two every time they want to go outside to play in the yard. Its just not feasible all of the time. Then you'll NEVER TRAIN HIM NOT TO DO THAT. I know there are people who do it regularly BWEEEAHAHAHHAHAAA!!! but I'm not one of those people and don't plan to become one. This IS "ALL ABHOWET ME," ain't it, tara o. aka tee. I have a large fenced-in backyard for the dogs to play & hang out in without the need for me to babysit them. But you can't leave them HOWET on accHOWENT of THEY'LL ESCAPE and bark and dig constantly. I'm sorry if anyone thinks that makes me less deserving or less devoted than is allowed a caring pet owner but that's the way it is. Naaah, not at all, tara o. aka tee. HOWEver, that little ISSUE of MURDERING and SHOCKING and CHOKING your dogs DOES make it a bit difficult to fathom you bein a DEVOTED DOG LOVER. IN FACT, YOUR POSTED CASE HISTORY makes you LOOK LIKE a miserable lying dog abusing punk thug coward active acute long term incurable MENTAL CASE who chokes shocks and murders dogs and CALLS IT DEVOTION. Third, if this behavior isn't 100% curable ALL behavior problems ARE 100% CURABLE NEARLY INSTANTLY but NOT if you HURT INTIMDIATE CHOKE SHOCK SPRAY AVERSIVES CRATE BRIBE SURGICALLY MUTILATE and MURDER INNOCENT CRITTERS, tara o. aka tee, you miserable lying dog abusing mental case {); ~ ) then he's going to be rehomed and its better You should GET RID of your dogs and child and SP-HOWES on accHOWENT of you're a MENTAL CASE tara o. aka tee. to figure that out *now*, after 7 weeks here, than to figure it out a month from now giving him that much more time to believe this is forever and make it that much more difficult to find himself rehomed later. HOWE COME you RESCUE DOG LOVERS think you can TRY dogs for a couple months and GET RID OF THEM and GET ANOTHER? THAT'S INSANE. THAT'S WHAT YOU JUST DONE BUT INSTEAD OF EXXXCHAGING YOU MURDERED YOUR OWN DEAD DOG Summer. REMEMBER??? This is taking into account Deja Vu? that should he require rehoming it may well take 1-2 months before the right, approved, home comes along. BWEEEEEEEEAAHAHAHAHHAHAHAAA!!! SO YOU'LL MURDER IT INSTEAD... SO IT WON'T SUFFER. I do NOT want to lose him Tsk tsk tsk... but you WON'T STOP HURTIN HIM. but if he has to go then its kinder for him to do it sooner rather than later. You mean pryor to him GETTIN ATTACHED to you HURTING and INTIMDIATING him, tara o. aka tee? There would be no good time for us because the entire family loves him SO LEARN HOWE TO HURT HIM ENOUGH TO MAKE IT WANT TO STAY THERE WHERE HE'S SO LOVED YOU'LL SPEND A FEW HUNDRED BUCKS ON A SHOCK COLLAR TO MAKE HIM FEEL WELCOME. BWEEEEEEEEEEEAAHAHAHHAHAHAAA!!! All of the above is why I'm desperate for a quick fix. HE WOULDN'T DO THAT IF YOU DIDN'T HURT HIM. I know they rarely exist NOT SO. The Amazing Puppy Wizard's 100% CONSISTENTLY NEARLY INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL FREE WWW Wits' End Dog Training Method Manual Students ALL OVER The WHOWEL WILD WORLD REPORT CURING ALL temperament and behavior problems NEARLY INSTANTLY. You and your MENTAL CASE PALS CALL THEM LIARS and FORGERIES. and that its frowned upon to hope for one but the situation is desperate. BWEEEEEEAHAHAHAHAHAHHAA!!! Well tara o. aka tee, ask tommy soronsen HOWE to HURT your dog JUST LIKE HOWE he taught professor melanie HOWE to jerk and choke Skeeter on her pronged spiked pinch choke collar for his DOMINANCE PISSIN. BWEEEEEEEEEAAHAHAHHAHAHAA!!! Its not just undesirable behavior but unsanitary, NOT AS UNSANITARY AS YOUR MINDS, dog lovers. disgusting NOT AS DISGUSTING AS YOUR MINDS, dog lovers. and requiring heavy effort on the part of all family members to keep it down to a minimum. IOW, THE DOG HAS TRAINED YOU TO PAY HIM ATTENTION. Fancy is acting withdrawn THEY RECENTLY FOUGHT. YOU KEEP PUNISHING HIM. THAT MAKE HER FEARFUL, tara o. aka tee. and the two dogs got into a fight on Sunday. SHAAAZZZAAAMMM??? What started as a perfect fit between perfect (IMO) dogs has quickly become something different. YOU MEAN YOU RUINED THEM JUST LIKE HOWE your pals done... Joe Joe is still an exceptional dog, But not for your MENTALLY ILLL HOWES. still a great fit, That so? PERHAPS YOU'RE TALKIN ABHOWET A DIFFERENT DOG? still the coolest boy I've ever had live with me Oh, so THAT'S HOWE COME you HURT him. but this problem is of the deal-breaking kind You mean, LIKE THIS?: "dejablues" wrote in message ... I recently rehomed one of my dogs that submissively urinated, we tried for two years to get him over it but nothing worked. It is not a behavior I can live with. ------------------ BWEEEEEEEEEEAAHAHHAHHAAA!!! and I want to find a way to make it disappear quickly. OH? You could DO THAT if you STOPPED HURTING HIM. We are the 4th home (okay, we were also number 2) BWEEEEEEEEAAHAHAHAHHAHAAA!!! Third time's the CHARM, eh tara? this poor dog has lived in in only 2.5 years and I don't want to see him go to number 5. SO YOU'LL HURT HIM SOMEMOORE... TILL HE GOES INSANE LIKE HOWE YOU DONE YOUR OWN DEAD DOG SUMMER. -- Tara HOWEDY multi mentally, socially, morally, ethically, challenged insufficent, stiffled, stunted, abused, abuser, tara o. aka tee, Tee wrote: "Janet Puistonen" wrote in message news:8eAte.11113$aR1.8755@trndny02... We were just discussing that at home yesterday, because my new rescue dog was supposedly "house trained," according to the forms from the shelter. But she is only partially so by my definition, since she has accidents in the house. Despite being taken out every few hours on a fairly regular schedule, she will relieve herself in the house if she feels the need and she's able to sneak off. Unlike a new puppy, she won't actually do it in from of you. My definition of house trained is "won't do it in the house under normal circumstances no matter what, unless sick." (The workday thing doesn't some up since we are both self employed and never leave the dog all day alone indoors.) Are you sure the accidents aren't stress/confusion related? You mean, on accHOWENT of HOWEsbreakin is INSTINCTIVE at four weeks of age, tara o. aka tee? The Amazing Puppy Wizard TENDS TO AGREE with THAT, tara o. aka tee. By that I mean the dog is in a new home with new people, smells, routines, expectations. Yeah, IOW, the dog AIN'T GOT NO BAD HABITS in his new environment so TRAININ is MUCH EZier, tara o. aka tee. The Amazing Puppy Wizard TENDS TO AGREE with THAT, too. It may be possible that she's still a little unsure of herself. She's had the dog for MONTHS. The Amazing Puppy Wizard does NOT TEND TO AGREE with THAT, tara o. aka tee. Also, have you had her checked for a UTI? You mean, on accHOWENT of you ain't got no method to HOWEsbreak a dog that keeps HOWEtwittin you. The Amazing Puppy Wizard TENDS TO AGREE with THAT, too, tara o. aka tee {): ~ ) -- Tara HOWEver, The Amazing Puppy Wizard DOES NOT TEND TO AGREE with THIS: "Tending To Agree With The Positive Reinforcement Method"? HOWEDY People, Hello Tara, "Tara O." wrote in message m... I tend to agree with the positive reinforcement method. Oh, that's nice. I tend to think people who tend to agree with positive reinforcement methods tend to be pulling our chains... That's what I tend to think, based on my experience working with people who tend to agree with positive reinforcement who TEND TO hurt their dogs when their tendencies to use positive methods are outweighed by their tendencies to run out of information or intellect and TEND to get frustrated and TEND NOT to do the things they TEND TO believe are right, when they TEND to be frustrated, or TEND to be at a loss for INTELLECT, and TEND TO resort to violence because they TEND to be shy on BRAINS... I TEND TO view those folks as hypocrites, that's what I TEND to do because I just happen to TEND to be HONEST, IMO, shock collars should be used only after normal obedience training methods have failed. If your NORMAL obedience training TENDED to properly train dogs, there would be a TENDENCY to have well trained dogs. But that's not the case, becasuse NORMAL obedience training TENDS to provoke, intimidate, and confound your dog and inhibit his ability to think and learn to want to work and think and learn... SEE? That's what I TEND to think about NORMAL obedience training which TENDS to FAIL because it TENDS to resort to VIOLENCE instead of TENDING TOWARDS THE MOST EFFECTIVE SCIENTIFIC METHODS AVAILABLE. It just bothers me to imagine shocking my dog, even at a very low frequency. It bothers me less to think of shocking the dog than thinking about what punishment and confrontation can do to a dog's temperament. That's what I tend to think based on my thirty eight years professional experience training dogs. I will definitely admit that there are many dogs who either can't or won't benefit from training without such things as e-collars. Is that based on your thirty eight years of experience specializing in temperament and behavior problems and protection training in giant breed dogs? Or is that based on your TENDANCY to believe incompetent dog abusing Thugs who tell you they TEND to get excellent results from HURTING dogs to train them because they TEND NOT TO be intelligent enough to outwit the cunning of the domestic puppy dog??? OR IS IT BASED ON YOUR TENDENCY TO MURDER YOUR OWN DEAD DOG Summer? I just hope its a last-resort, not a first. And I just hope you figure out why your pals here who hurt dogs to train them TEND to claim they have me in their killfiles, because they TEND NOT TO be able to answer my questions in good conscience...That's what they TEND to do around here because our lying dog abusing Thugs TEND to be INCOMPETENT, IMMORAL, UNETHICAL, UNPRINCIPLED, DOG ABUSING COWARDS. Like yourself. That's what I tend to think. Your pal, Jerry "The PHONY," Howe. j;~} The Amazing Puppy Wizard. {) ; ~ ) Date: Thu, 07 Oct 2004 17:12:11 GMT Local: Thurs, Oct 7 2004 10:12 am Subject: "I'm Shocked That I Shocked" tara o. aka tee, NC Boxer Rescue Abuse HOWEDY People Here's WON of HOWER MENTAL CASES hurtin dogs and lying abHOWET it again. "I'm shocked that I shocked" "Tara O." wrote in message ... Due to someone reprimanding Jar-Jar & the word "rescue" in the post, I decided to read down and see what he was spewing now. I was able to learn that besides choking, pinching, crating, abusing and murdering my dog, I also shocked her. I must be suffering from amnesia. Can someone point me to a post where I said I shocked my dog, or any dog, or that I even know *how* to use an e-collar....assuming I had one which must have been stolen at the same time I lost my memory. One would think Jerry would be happy with the "murder" part and all my other training sins but evidently not. -- Tara HOWEDY tara o., You didn't HURT INTIMIDATE and MURFDER your own DEAD DOG Summer: Date: 2003-04-28 18:09:04 PST "Tara O." wrote: Labs are a breed that are normally trained for field work with ear pinches, e-collars and other forms of physical interaction without making them fearful or aggressive. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D From: Tara O. ) Subject: Dane hyper when passing other dogs Date: 2001-04-21 12:07:54 PST I think its pertinent to mention that I've never had any dogs who exhibited signs of aggression or were in any way, shape, or form resistent to whatever "training" I did with them. I would not feel comfortable relying on my past experience or a book to train a dog to stop biting, snapping or growling. -- Tara O. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D From: Tara O. ) Subject: Canine Behaviors For Dummies Date: 2001-06-11 19:42:23 PST "joshua" wrote in message ... I cant seem to understand why people believe prong collars are cruel and inhumane. They do nothing more than pinch, getting the attention of the animal. Choke collars, on the other hand, do permanent damage. They bruise the esophagus. Shock collars will eventually destroy nerve endings, much the same as electric fencing. Joshua, you have just reopened a can of worms that can quickly cause infestation here lol -- Tara O. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D From: Tara O. ) Subject: jerry howe Date: 2001-04-04 11:58:06 PST People are tired of being abused and insulted simply for saying they use a prong collar, or a choke collar, or an e-collar, or a crate, etc. If you want to LEARN more about dog training and dog behavior, then listen to what they have to say, too. "I've never not listened to what people say here. I use a crate, am about to begin with a choke collar, I'm not the bad guy here." tara o. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D From: Tara O. ) Subject: Electronic Training Collars Date: 2001-05-11 17:29:33 PST ""Twzl, Sligo and Roy Happy Together"" wrote BTW, this is one of the frequent topics on obedience email lists. When people say that they haven't used corrections, it turns out that they feel that if they do it, it's not a real correction. That makes sense in a weird sort of way. I don't honestly think that its humanly possible to train anyone or anything without correction. Its human nature to say 'no' or to stop a behavior by doing something. I used a tin can with coins to correct Summer's bad puppy behaviors and the cold shoulder to correct her other less desirable behaviors. I have said 'no' so many times that I probably sound like a broken record. Amie can attest to that lol. It seems to me that some people are automatically equating the term correction with punishment. I guess they can go hand in hand since my tin can wasn't something Summer liked. My ignoring her when she's misbehaving is also something she doesn't like. Therefore it can be viewed as punishment? And that term is 100% negative. Maybe if more people saw it as correction and not the total negative, they'd be less inclined to want to be PP. Don't know if the way I wrote that made sense, it makes sense in my head but then again the men with the white coats could come a'knockin at any moment. Tara O. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D From: Tara O. ) Subject: Any hope? rage? Date: 2003-03-26 05:46:02 PST Yes I see and understand your point. There's no such thing as 100% vigilence 100% of the time IMO. You could call an e-fence company to find out if its possible to wire only your front door so that if she gets within a certain range of that front door the collar will start working. I'd think there would be a way to work that and it may be inexpensive to do so. There are also items called Scat Mats that you place in front of doors or any area you don't want your dog to proceed through. When stepping on the mat, it gives off a vibration, something which most dogs hate. They'll stay far away from the mats. I believe you can buy them from -- Tara =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D Tara O. ) Subject: Need advice--barking dog Date: 2003-08-06 17:38:14 PST you could consider installing an invisible fence just inside the fence line so he cannot get too close. You could talk to your neighbor about splitting the cost of whichever alternative you both find most acceptable. -- Tara =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D From: Tara O. ) Subject: Containment Collars Date: 2003-03-11 07:12:57 I know people who have electric fences and it works very well for them. I know people who have them and whose dogs escape and refuse to come back in. From the details I know of all involved, I wouldn't use an e-fence on: 1. An adult dog that wasn't raised with the fence from a puppy 2. A dog with a high prey drive 3. A very stubborn dog If I put my female out in an e-fence, the very first kid, cat, dog or squirrel she sees would have her bolting through the barrier shock or not. When she finally loses interest in whatever has caused her to leave and her adrenalin has diminished, she will think rationally and realize she's not willing to come back into the yard because she knows the shock would get her. you have a dog who just has to go after or up to any and everything that walks down the street then I'd definitely not recommend one of these systems. The people I know who it works for installed them when their dogs were pups so they were brought up trained to it. Two of the ones I know it didn't work for have adult adopted dogs who weren't raised with this kind of invisible barrier. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D From: Tara O. ) Subject: escape artist, thunder, aggression questions Date: 2001-05-12 07:56:04 PST Since he got a taste of freedom and knows he can get out I doubt you'll be able to stop him short of tethering him or using a more sophisticated device like an e-fence but I wouldn't recommend going the electronic fence route without first doing your homework on the pros and cons of them and understand that they are not fool-proof. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D MacKenzie's First Pinch Collar Class Date: 2003-07-08 13:54:19 PST I consider myself to be a pretty good basic obed. trainer of Boxers with some learned but not necessarily practiced, advanced training knowledge. I think this because not only have I worked with all the dogs I've had at my house but I'm also the one in charge of all the dogs in our rescue, their behavioral issues (identifying and working with), basic training (done in the foster home) and a host of other things. I'm the one who gives the advice and walks the foster volunteers through alot of things. Now I don't believe, for a second, that I would be successful at teaching basic obedience to other dogs in a class environment. Maybe I would but probably not. Other trainers with class experience may think I have no clue what I'm doing because my experience has been primarily hands-on and with only one breed. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D From: "Tee" Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 14:14:15 -0500 Subject: Free to Good Home, One Slightly Used Boxer "shelly" wrote in message arble.net... mmmmm. potatoes. potatoes are harriet's favorite, and elliott's *only* vice. he wants to be a potatoE farmer when he grows opposable thumbs (i think he is in talks with HarCo about thumb prostheses). i can't count the number of times i've come home to potatoes strewn throughout the house. and, there are toothmarks in every damned one of them, too! don't tell anyone, but i took a big-assed bowl of elliott-inspired potatoE salad to a party last summer. heh. LOL. Well you know what they say about dogs' mouths. that sounds familiar. and, if it's not the dogs, it's the cats. did i tell ya'll about the stick of butter harriet scored from the cats? i finally got smart and put the butter in the upper cupboard. unfortunately, i forgot to shut the door all the way, so echo (the same cat), climbed inside and helped herself. i would've never noticed, except for the tip of her tail sticking out of the cupboard. Too funny. I never realized cats were such thieves. i've given up hope that harriet will grow out of her, um, creativeness. i try to look at the bright side: it's relatively cheap entertainment (i almost always get a good laugh out of it). Mentally I've accepted that she'll always be like this. It should be listed as a breed trait IMO because most Boxers are counter cruisers & trash raiders anyway. I still have hope though only because I want the demmed ugly crate out of my living room. She loves her crate unfortunately and the last time I tried to take it away she let me know she didn't appreciate it. Its just big, taller than my regular furniture, so even in disguise it looks out of place. she's been talking to harriet! Yeah well, I've long suspected someone has been at this keyboard when I'm sleeping. Now I know who. You really ought to shut down your pc at night, me too, so the two heathens can't talk to each other. ha! i can usually tell when harriet's been into something, because bits of it get stuck to her flews. I wish that were the case with Fancy. Instead it looks like she dove, nose first, into a bowl of shaving cream. aw, did she have her halo on? absolutely and it was at its brightest too. clever girl! shh, she can hear you! mine, when they're caught red-handed, run to their crates. i guess their crates are doggie Home Base? harriet will even run to hers if she *thinks* she might've done something Bad. and, i think i've mentioned before that elliott hides food in harriet's crate--never in his, though, so i have to wonder if he's that smart or that st00pid. it's often hard to tell with him. Fancy does that when I'm home and she's done something naughty. Its only when I'm not in the house and she does something that I catch her sitting on the sofa (or the kitchen table once...as if THAT didn't give her away) looking all angelic. Now once I find what she has done, she bolts to her crate and pretends to be sleeping. -- Tara BWEEEEEEEEEEEEAAAHAHAHHAHAAAA!!! The Amazing Puppy Wizard {) ; ~ ) |
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Buzzsaw, you have far too much time on your hands.
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Hello MommaMia,
MommaMia wrote: Buzzsaw, you have far too much time on your hands. Curious that Buzzsaw has 'too much time on his hands'. Perhaps you'd have enough time on your own hands to be a little more RESPECTFUL of the only bonafide genuine successful advice you've receive here, if you invested LESS TIME playing grabass and MORE EFFORT STUDYING the INFORMATION you've been blessed with, MommaMia? Yours Truly, Shame Guiltanfrustration. |
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"MommaMia" wrote in message
lkaboutpets.com... Please help. I have a female german shepard that has chewed a recliner, sofa, carpet, shoes, picture frames, games, etc. It just goes on and on. She has chew toys, squeaky toys, knotted ropes, but is literally chewing me out of house and home. Replacements are going to cost me close to $3000.00! What can I do to stop the chewing!! When I am home with her, she is good as gold most of the time, but when I'm not home... it's a free for all. I can no longer keep her in a kennel, she chews through the fence! I've been through three of them! I am about ready to get rid of her. She is a beautiful dog, mostly black with tan paws and chest. But her beauty will only get her so far.. and it almost has her in a shelter! Please help me!! You don't say if you adopted her from someone else. If that's the case it may be SA. My dogs did the same thing and still do occasionally. What I do is keep frozen beef bones in the freezer. When I have to go somewhere, depending on how long I plan to be gone, I select a size that will last for the time I'm gone. Problem solved. Here's another tip for those who have dogs that chase cars. Take a broom handle about 18 inches long and suspend it from the dog's collar so when they run, their "knees" hit the handle. It takes about three weeks but they catch on. You most likely will have to repeat the "treatment" from time to time so hang on to the broom handle. |
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