Mini Schnauzer Size

"Rocky" wrote in message
...
"S.Smith" said in rec.pets.dogs.breeds:

It looks like my pup is non-standard by color and
weight.

How tall is he at the withers? If you can't measure him there,
the top of the shoulder blades is a reasonable approximation.

What colour is he? Can you post a picture somewhere?

--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.

Hi Matt,
I just tried to send a pic of Petey and it did not go thru. I measured him
and he is 16" from the bottom of his front leg to his shoulder blades. His
color is "Wheaten"...rather beig or creme..not white. I wish I could get
the pic to you. Please let me know what you think.
TIA
Petey's Mom

Melinda Shore wrote:

In article ,
Phyrie wrote:

Erm, yeah there are. When you buy a dog from a reputable breeder and you've
done your research into your breed, you should get exactly what you paid
for.


No, there's still variability and surprises. You should get
a guarantee that the breeder will take the dog back, and
there should be fewer surprises, but no surprises in a
litter would be a surprise.

But if you go with a responsible breeder it's extremely unlikely you'd
end up with a dog that is way, way over the standard. Sure, you might
have a bite go off, or even pop up with an unexpected genetic issue. But
the chances of getting a hugely oversized dog are pretty slim. The OP
also has a "wheaton" dog, which is a disallowed coat color.

In article oNeXl.733935$yE1.269569@attbi_s21,
Robin Nuttall wrote:
But if you go with a responsible breeder it's extremely unlikely you'd
end up with a dog that is way, way over the standard.

I don't know - I think that you might be using a recursive
definition of "responsible," and different breeds have
greater or lesser degrees of variability depending on things
like the breadth of the gene pool. An insanely
"responsible" breeder can even get disallowed coat colors -
it's about probabilities, not absolutes.
--
Melinda Shore - Software longa, hardware brevis -

Prouder than ever to be a member of the reality-based community

In article ,
(Melinda Shore) wrote:

An insanely
"responsible" breeder can even get disallowed coat colors -
it's about probabilities, not absolutes.

I admit to not knowing a ton about color genetics when there's a lot of
variation, but DNA testing allows a breeder to know who is carrying what
and predict color(s) of pups. In FCRs, this can be important to not
have a litter of yellows (which has happened when people aren't doing
their work).

--
Janet Boss
www.bestfriendsdogobedience.com

In article ,
Janet Boss wrote:
I admit to not knowing a ton about color genetics when there's a lot of
variation, but DNA testing allows a breeder to know who is carrying what
and predict color(s) of pups.

But even then you're talking about probabilities, not
absolutes.
--
Melinda Shore - Software longa, hardware brevis -

Prouder than ever to be a member of the reality-based community

Melinda Shore wrote:
In article oNeXl.733935$yE1.269569@attbi_s21,
Robin Nuttall wrote:

But if you go with a responsible breeder it's extremely unlikely you'd
end up with a dog that is way, way over the standard.


I don't know - I think that you might be using a recursive
definition of "responsible," and different breeds have
greater or lesser degrees of variability depending on things
like the breadth of the gene pool. An insanely
"responsible" breeder can even get disallowed coat colors -
it's about probabilities, not absolutes.

Since the wheaten color is, as far as I understand it, a simple
recessive, it's pretty easy to avoid. As for my definition of
responsible breeder being "recursive," I'm not exactly sure what you
mean. But chances are I've known a lot more breeders of breeds such as
Mini and Standard schnauzers as well as other breeds than you have, and
yeah, I have a pretty good idea of what pops up easily and what doesn't.
Of course I also know the definition of "unlikely," which does not mean,
recursively or not, "never." It's extremely unlikely to produce dogs
that are *substantially* over the standard if you're doing it right. Not
impossible, but very unlikely. Not that there aren't some that are
slightly over, but in a breed with an actual height DQ, such as is in
Mini Schnauzers (anything over 14" or under 12" is a DQ) it's not likely
at all.

In article ,
(Melinda Shore) wrote:


But even then you're talking about probabilities, not
absolutes.

Not really. You can eliminate the possibility of recessives.

--
Janet Boss
www.bestfriendsdogobedience.com

In article ,
Janet Boss wrote:
Not really. You can eliminate the possibility of recessives.

Okay, fair enough. It's tough to do in a breed with a
really narrow gene pool, but it's all about the tradeoffs.
--
Melinda Shore - Software longa, hardware brevis -

Prouder than ever to be a member of the reality-based community

In article ,
(Melinda Shore) wrote:


Okay, fair enough. It's tough to do in a breed with a
really narrow gene pool, but it's all about the tradeoffs.

There's a reason people have had "surprise!" yellow FCRs in the past!
Small gene pools are rough for a number of reasons. When a breed comes
in more than one color (accepted or not), there's a lot to think about
in addition to the cancer, CHD, etc, etc, etc. Have I ever mentioned
that the idea of breeding would scare the hell out of me?

--
Janet Boss
www.bestfriendsdogobedience.com

In article ,
Janet Boss wrote:
Have I ever mentioned
that the idea of breeding would scare the hell out of me?

Me too! Fortunately it's not *that* hard to find dogs that
meet my needs, so it's really not even a question. Bitches
in the line of dogs I like throw really huge litters and I
cannot imagine ending up with 10 or 11 or 12 puppies that
just don't work out.
--
Melinda Shore - Software longa, hardware brevis -

Prouder than ever to be a member of the reality-based community