German Shepherd Breeder

wrote in message
...
On 24 Mar 2004 05:56:11 GMT Leah -off whittled
these words:
Anybody familiar with these breeders:
http://www.vonhena-c.com

I'm drooling over those puppies. (Yes, pug is now fighting with GSD at
the
top of my wish list. :}

Leah, you have been reading these groups for a long time now. Based
purely on the web site, what's to drool over? I don't get it.

Depending upon what you want in a dog, I'm not sure I see a whole lot
to drool over. They claim their dogs are titled, yet just looking at their
stud dogs only shows fairly low-level titling.
Even on what I presume
is their older dog (Reiko), he has TT, CGC, AD, CD, HIC, SchH1.
Temperament Test, that's great. CGC, that's *basic* manners testing
that IMHO your regular housedog *should* have. CD, AKC's Companion
Dog title, great! But, if you're "advertising" your dogs as "show
obedience"
homes (which they do on the About Us page) I'd sure want to see titles
waaaay beyond the CD, at least a UD, or a UDX.
HIC, the herding instinct test, a cool thing for sure, but not really a
title that tells a lot about a dog's true herding ability. (Heck, Coda's
got an HIC, and doubtful he could herd sheep to get him too far, and a
friend's Rottie, that is now in Herding Excellent, flunked his because all
he wanted to do was mount the sheep!! laugh).
The AD (The Ausdauerprüfung, a 12 mile Endurance Test) & SchH1, good deal.
For dogs advertised as working dogs, I'd consider these essential titles in
a GSD.

Let alone the fact that they state Reiko has been bred *20* times, and they
list no ages (at least on the few pages I looked at). *20* times?

And, this statement, list on one of the "breeding females" pages (Ivy),
bothers me a lot:
" She is a good size female and when she is done filling out, she will be
around 75 lbs."
Are they breeding her already, and she's not done growing? Or, are they
simply banking on the fact that she's got good working lines behind her &
they're planning to breed her, regardless of HER merits?

There are all kinds of "right" things on the site, but there are things
missing.
I suppose if you were
just looking for a laid-back pet GSD (they say their dogs are mellow & laid
back) , it might not be so bad. But, if you
were looking for a true working dog, I'd probably look elsewhere.
Shelly & The Boys

And...holy crap, they have *5* litters/breedings planned in the course
of a few short months (Jan-April)?
Well, I guess that would explain the lack of titling on their dogs.
They're too busy breeding.

Yikes. Researching puppies is (well, CAN be, if done correctly, IMHO) a
lot of work, and I'd venture to say maybe even more in a "popular" breed,
such as Labs or GSDs because there are simply more people to talk with!

I'll also put myself out as an example. Until you've done it, you don't
see what you could have the first time around. As much as I adore
Bodhi, looking back, there are minor things I'd like to see different in
my next dog. Each time is a learning experience, for sure.
No "probably" about it, I'd look elsewhere.
Shelly & The Boys

"Shelly & The Boys" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
...
On 24 Mar 2004 05:56:11 GMT Leah -off whittled
these words:
Anybody familiar with these breeders:
http://www.vonhena-c.com

I'm drooling over those puppies. (Yes, pug is now fighting with GSD
at
the
top of my wish list. :}

Leah, you have been reading these groups for a long time now. Based
purely on the web site, what's to drool over? I don't get it.

Depending upon what you want in a dog, I'm not sure I see a whole lot
to drool over. They claim their dogs are titled, yet just looking at
their
stud dogs only shows fairly low-level titling.
Even on what I presume
is their older dog (Reiko), he has TT, CGC, AD, CD, HIC, SchH1.
Temperament Test, that's great. CGC, that's *basic* manners testing
that IMHO your regular housedog *should* have. CD, AKC's Companion
Dog title, great! But, if you're "advertising" your dogs as "show
obedience"
homes (which they do on the About Us page) I'd sure want to see titles
waaaay beyond the CD, at least a UD, or a UDX.
HIC, the herding instinct test, a cool thing for sure, but not really a
title that tells a lot about a dog's true herding ability. (Heck, Coda's
got an HIC, and doubtful he could herd sheep to get him too far, and a
friend's Rottie, that is now in Herding Excellent, flunked his because all
he wanted to do was mount the sheep!! laugh).
The AD (The Ausdauerprüfung, a 12 mile Endurance Test) & SchH1, good deal.
For dogs advertised as working dogs, I'd consider these essential titles
in
a GSD.

Let alone the fact that they state Reiko has been bred *20* times, and
they
list no ages (at least on the few pages I looked at). *20* times?

And, this statement, list on one of the "breeding females" pages (Ivy),
bothers me a lot:
" She is a good size female and when she is done filling out, she will be
around 75 lbs."
Are they breeding her already, and she's not done growing? Or, are they
simply banking on the fact that she's got good working lines behind her &
they're planning to breed her, regardless of HER merits?

There are all kinds of "right" things on the site, but there are things
missing.
I suppose if you were
just looking for a laid-back pet GSD (they say their dogs are mellow &
laid
back) , it might not be so bad. But, if you
were looking for a true working dog, I'd probably look elsewhere.
Shelly & The Boys

And...holy crap, they have *5* litters/breedings planned in the course
of a few short months (Jan-April)?
Well, I guess that would explain the lack of titling on their dogs.
They're too busy breeding.

Yikes. Researching puppies is (well, CAN be, if done correctly, IMHO) a
lot of work, and I'd venture to say maybe even more in a "popular" breed,
such as Labs or GSDs because there are simply more people to talk with!

I'll also put myself out as an example. Until you've done it, you don't
see what you could have the first time around. As much as I adore
Bodhi, looking back, there are minor things I'd like to see different in
my next dog. Each time is a learning experience, for sure.
No "probably" about it, I'd look elsewhere.
Shelly & The Boys

"Shelly & The Boys" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
...
On 24 Mar 2004 05:56:11 GMT Leah -off whittled
these words:
Anybody familiar with these breeders:
http://www.vonhena-c.com

I'm drooling over those puppies. (Yes, pug is now fighting with GSD
at
the
top of my wish list. :}

Leah, you have been reading these groups for a long time now. Based
purely on the web site, what's to drool over? I don't get it.

Depending upon what you want in a dog, I'm not sure I see a whole lot
to drool over. They claim their dogs are titled, yet just looking at
their
stud dogs only shows fairly low-level titling.
Even on what I presume
is their older dog (Reiko), he has TT, CGC, AD, CD, HIC, SchH1.
Temperament Test, that's great. CGC, that's *basic* manners testing
that IMHO your regular housedog *should* have. CD, AKC's Companion
Dog title, great! But, if you're "advertising" your dogs as "show
obedience"
homes (which they do on the About Us page) I'd sure want to see titles
waaaay beyond the CD, at least a UD, or a UDX.
HIC, the herding instinct test, a cool thing for sure, but not really a
title that tells a lot about a dog's true herding ability. (Heck, Coda's
got an HIC, and doubtful he could herd sheep to get him too far, and a
friend's Rottie, that is now in Herding Excellent, flunked his because all
he wanted to do was mount the sheep!! laugh).
The AD (The Ausdauerprüfung, a 12 mile Endurance Test) & SchH1, good deal.
For dogs advertised as working dogs, I'd consider these essential titles
in
a GSD.

Let alone the fact that they state Reiko has been bred *20* times, and
they
list no ages (at least on the few pages I looked at). *20* times?

And, this statement, list on one of the "breeding females" pages (Ivy),
bothers me a lot:
" She is a good size female and when she is done filling out, she will be
around 75 lbs."
Are they breeding her already, and she's not done growing? Or, are they
simply banking on the fact that she's got good working lines behind her &
they're planning to breed her, regardless of HER merits?

There are all kinds of "right" things on the site, but there are things
missing.
I suppose if you were
just looking for a laid-back pet GSD (they say their dogs are mellow &
laid
back) , it might not be so bad. But, if you
were looking for a true working dog, I'd probably look elsewhere.
Shelly & The Boys

And...holy crap, they have *5* litters/breedings planned in the course
of a few short months (Jan-April)?
Well, I guess that would explain the lack of titling on their dogs.
They're too busy breeding.

Yikes. Researching puppies is (well, CAN be, if done correctly, IMHO) a
lot of work, and I'd venture to say maybe even more in a "popular" breed,
such as Labs or GSDs because there are simply more people to talk with!

I'll also put myself out as an example. Until you've done it, you don't
see what you could have the first time around. As much as I adore
Bodhi, looking back, there are minor things I'd like to see different in
my next dog. Each time is a learning experience, for sure.
No "probably" about it, I'd look elsewhere.
Shelly & The Boys

"Shelly & The Boys" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
...
On 24 Mar 2004 05:56:11 GMT Leah -off whittled
these words:
Anybody familiar with these breeders:
http://www.vonhena-c.com

I'm drooling over those puppies. (Yes, pug is now fighting with GSD
at
the
top of my wish list. :}

Leah, you have been reading these groups for a long time now. Based
purely on the web site, what's to drool over? I don't get it.

Depending upon what you want in a dog, I'm not sure I see a whole lot
to drool over. They claim their dogs are titled, yet just looking at
their
stud dogs only shows fairly low-level titling.
Even on what I presume
is their older dog (Reiko), he has TT, CGC, AD, CD, HIC, SchH1.
Temperament Test, that's great. CGC, that's *basic* manners testing
that IMHO your regular housedog *should* have. CD, AKC's Companion
Dog title, great! But, if you're "advertising" your dogs as "show
obedience"
homes (which they do on the About Us page) I'd sure want to see titles
waaaay beyond the CD, at least a UD, or a UDX.
HIC, the herding instinct test, a cool thing for sure, but not really a
title that tells a lot about a dog's true herding ability. (Heck, Coda's
got an HIC, and doubtful he could herd sheep to get him too far, and a
friend's Rottie, that is now in Herding Excellent, flunked his because all
he wanted to do was mount the sheep!! laugh).
The AD (The Ausdauerprüfung, a 12 mile Endurance Test) & SchH1, good deal.
For dogs advertised as working dogs, I'd consider these essential titles
in
a GSD.

Let alone the fact that they state Reiko has been bred *20* times, and
they
list no ages (at least on the few pages I looked at). *20* times?

And, this statement, list on one of the "breeding females" pages (Ivy),
bothers me a lot:
" She is a good size female and when she is done filling out, she will be
around 75 lbs."
Are they breeding her already, and she's not done growing? Or, are they
simply banking on the fact that she's got good working lines behind her &
they're planning to breed her, regardless of HER merits?

There are all kinds of "right" things on the site, but there are things
missing.
I suppose if you were
just looking for a laid-back pet GSD (they say their dogs are mellow &
laid
back) , it might not be so bad. But, if you
were looking for a true working dog, I'd probably look elsewhere.
Shelly & The Boys

And...holy crap, they have *5* litters/breedings planned in the course
of a few short months (Jan-April)?
Well, I guess that would explain the lack of titling on their dogs.
They're too busy breeding.

Yikes. Researching puppies is (well, CAN be, if done correctly, IMHO) a
lot of work, and I'd venture to say maybe even more in a "popular" breed,
such as Labs or GSDs because there are simply more people to talk with!

I'll also put myself out as an example. Until you've done it, you don't
see what you could have the first time around. As much as I adore
Bodhi, looking back, there are minor things I'd like to see different in
my next dog. Each time is a learning experience, for sure.
No "probably" about it, I'd look elsewhere.
Shelly & The Boys

"Shelly & The Boys" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
...
On 24 Mar 2004 05:56:11 GMT Leah -off whittled
these words:
Anybody familiar with these breeders:
http://www.vonhena-c.com

I'm drooling over those puppies. (Yes, pug is now fighting with GSD
at
the
top of my wish list. :}

Leah, you have been reading these groups for a long time now. Based
purely on the web site, what's to drool over? I don't get it.

Depending upon what you want in a dog, I'm not sure I see a whole lot
to drool over. They claim their dogs are titled, yet just looking at
their
stud dogs only shows fairly low-level titling.
Even on what I presume
is their older dog (Reiko), he has TT, CGC, AD, CD, HIC, SchH1.
Temperament Test, that's great. CGC, that's *basic* manners testing
that IMHO your regular housedog *should* have. CD, AKC's Companion
Dog title, great! But, if you're "advertising" your dogs as "show
obedience"
homes (which they do on the About Us page) I'd sure want to see titles
waaaay beyond the CD, at least a UD, or a UDX.
HIC, the herding instinct test, a cool thing for sure, but not really a
title that tells a lot about a dog's true herding ability. (Heck, Coda's
got an HIC, and doubtful he could herd sheep to get him too far, and a
friend's Rottie, that is now in Herding Excellent, flunked his because all
he wanted to do was mount the sheep!! laugh).
The AD (The Ausdauerprüfung, a 12 mile Endurance Test) & SchH1, good deal.
For dogs advertised as working dogs, I'd consider these essential titles
in
a GSD.

Let alone the fact that they state Reiko has been bred *20* times, and
they
list no ages (at least on the few pages I looked at). *20* times?

And, this statement, list on one of the "breeding females" pages (Ivy),
bothers me a lot:
" She is a good size female and when she is done filling out, she will be
around 75 lbs."
Are they breeding her already, and she's not done growing? Or, are they
simply banking on the fact that she's got good working lines behind her &
they're planning to breed her, regardless of HER merits?

There are all kinds of "right" things on the site, but there are things
missing.
I suppose if you were
just looking for a laid-back pet GSD (they say their dogs are mellow &
laid
back) , it might not be so bad. But, if you
were looking for a true working dog, I'd probably look elsewhere.
Shelly & The Boys

Shelly & The Boys wrote:

Yikes. Researching puppies is (well, CAN be, if done correctly, IMHO) a
lot of work, and I'd venture to say maybe even more in a "popular" breed,
such as Labs or GSDs because there are simply more people to talk with!


Indeed it is a lot of work. One thing that is always a good idea when
researching is to
talk to the local club, such as GSD club of Austin in my case. The
people are
always friendly, helpful and have a resource of great information. I
don't know
of any Club Pres that is going to direct a person to a puppy mill or a
bad breeder.
I suppose it can happen but I would think it is rare. Also going to dogs
shows
and speaking with breeders of dogs you see that you like. But that won't
always
give you as much information as the breed club does. And lots of breed clubs
also have training they do for their members and one can also go watch
some of the pups from various breeders locally in training that have
been sold
to new to people or kept by the breeder. At least this is what I have
found very
helpful.

Gwen

Shelly & The Boys wrote:

Yikes. Researching puppies is (well, CAN be, if done correctly, IMHO) a
lot of work, and I'd venture to say maybe even more in a "popular" breed,
such as Labs or GSDs because there are simply more people to talk with!


Indeed it is a lot of work. One thing that is always a good idea when
researching is to
talk to the local club, such as GSD club of Austin in my case. The
people are
always friendly, helpful and have a resource of great information. I
don't know
of any Club Pres that is going to direct a person to a puppy mill or a
bad breeder.
I suppose it can happen but I would think it is rare. Also going to dogs
shows
and speaking with breeders of dogs you see that you like. But that won't
always
give you as much information as the breed club does. And lots of breed clubs
also have training they do for their members and one can also go watch
some of the pups from various breeders locally in training that have
been sold
to new to people or kept by the breeder. At least this is what I have
found very
helpful.

Gwen

Shelly & The Boys wrote:

Yikes. Researching puppies is (well, CAN be, if done correctly, IMHO) a
lot of work, and I'd venture to say maybe even more in a "popular" breed,
such as Labs or GSDs because there are simply more people to talk with!


Indeed it is a lot of work. One thing that is always a good idea when
researching is to
talk to the local club, such as GSD club of Austin in my case. The
people are
always friendly, helpful and have a resource of great information. I
don't know
of any Club Pres that is going to direct a person to a puppy mill or a
bad breeder.
I suppose it can happen but I would think it is rare. Also going to dogs
shows
and speaking with breeders of dogs you see that you like. But that won't
always
give you as much information as the breed club does. And lots of breed clubs
also have training they do for their members and one can also go watch
some of the pups from various breeders locally in training that have
been sold
to new to people or kept by the breeder. At least this is what I have
found very
helpful.

Gwen

Shelly & The Boys wrote:

Yikes. Researching puppies is (well, CAN be, if done correctly, IMHO) a
lot of work, and I'd venture to say maybe even more in a "popular" breed,
such as Labs or GSDs because there are simply more people to talk with!


Indeed it is a lot of work. One thing that is always a good idea when
researching is to
talk to the local club, such as GSD club of Austin in my case. The
people are
always friendly, helpful and have a resource of great information. I
don't know
of any Club Pres that is going to direct a person to a puppy mill or a
bad breeder.
I suppose it can happen but I would think it is rare. Also going to dogs
shows
and speaking with breeders of dogs you see that you like. But that won't
always
give you as much information as the breed club does. And lots of breed clubs
also have training they do for their members and one can also go watch
some of the pups from various breeders locally in training that have
been sold
to new to people or kept by the breeder. At least this is what I have
found very
helpful.

Gwen

"J1Boss" wrote in message
...
Let alone the fact that they state Reiko has been bred *20* times, and
they
list no ages (at least on the few pages I looked at). *20* times?

Dec 14, 1994 according to OFA. One listed offspring is "MILD" under hips.
Not
sure what that is instead of Excellent, Good, Fair, Poor!

Thanks Janet. I was too lazy to go check OFA.
I would venture to say that "one *LISTED*" is probably accurate.
"Mild" would be the degree of dysplasia, as in Mild, Moderate and
Severe (my Coda is a borderline Mild/Moderate).

Out of 20 breedings, take an average and say 5 puppies a litter
and you've got 100 pups. Out of those, how many went to pet home?
They state on their site that most of them do. And, how many pet
homes do OFA? A fairly small percentage, to be sure.

I notice that this particular site says they offer a 48 hr return policy,
but
no listing of any signs of responsibility for the pup as it is older. They
even
say, under their HD guarantee that they'll send you another puppy and you
don't have to return the first one.
Of course, when producing that kind of numbers, who could offer to take
the puppy back if something were to happen to the owners!?

I'm curious, is there a way to tell when a dog enters the AKC studbooks
(when they produce their first litter)? Is it online somewhere, or do you
have to go to the AKC website (and probably pay) to look it up?
I have been researching on the BSD pedigree site, and noticed that
many dogs have their registration number, then a number in parenthesis,
then their whelp date & death date (if they're dead). The number
the website designer has in parenthesis is the date the dog/bitch produced
their first litter. Sort of nice, so you can see what age they were first
bred.
Very nice, in a breed such as Belgians, where epilepsy & seizuring is
an issue that has an onset between the ages of 2-4 or 5 years of age.
Shelly & The Boys