Eukanuba or Hill's Science Diet

"Drachen" wrote in news:12q4ljbj5h9nt79
@corp.supernews.com:

they are sharp when cooked... not when raw...

Untrue. I've cut up plenty of raw chickens and chicken bones in my
life, and my experience is that long bones are sharp even when raw.

--
Shelly
http://www.cat-sidh.net (the Mother Ship)
http://esther.cat-sidh.net (Letters to Esther)

X is for Xerxes devoured by mice.
-- Edward Gorey, The Gashlycrumb Tinies

*LE SIGH*...

LOOK PEOPLE... what I am saying, is that there are other altenatives rather
than just tossing kibble full of colourings, additives and other crap at
dogs... perhaps a combination diet... who knows... but the fact that there
are other alternatives out there and not one of you IS an expert, nor am I,
but I'm at least following advice of respectible breeders, *who have had
long lived healthy dogs, winners of all sorts through responsible breeding
etc* and vets who have done research and is interested in the health and
safety of the animal first...

vets are pushers for dogfood companies... I don't trust most dentists
either... but thats another story...

"diddy" wrote in message
...
in thread : "Drachen"
whittled the following words:

I'm not a fluffhead... nor do I think you are sarcastic anti-barf food
individual... with the right supervision, and minor preparations, the
barf diet can work wonderfully...

you'r friend was a dolt...



Yanno, I fed raw, natural diets to my very best dog ever, I consulted with
a Holistic vet nutritionist, and still had a dog succumb to serious and
nearly deadly (cost over $100 k over his last four years to maintain)
nutritional related consequences. I will never ever trust my dog's diet to
a homemade diet again.
I want a food with nutritionists on board. I don't have special demands
dogs (as in mushing dogs, that will trot over a thousand miles in one
week), 15 miles a day max is all the feeding requirements I will ever have
to accomodate for.
I want a major brand company that does feeding trials, and has
nutritionists on board. The more nutritionists and Veterinarians the
better.
I did the homemade diet. And although I will not ever tell you how to
feed,
I think (personally) that you are a fool and caught up in a fad in the
worst interest for your dog, and you have bought into a lot of bullshit on
the web, to your dog's pity. Now that's what "I" really think.

That's my OPINION. You are certainly entitled to your opinion, but I will
never again, attempt to feed in such a manner. EVER.

Melinda Shore wrote:
Drachen wrote:
raw chicken... chopped up... and the regular veggies that you eat
yourself... avoid the starches for the most part... but other than that...
should be easy enough for you to feed him... barely any preperation, a
chicken leg, or thigh, or leg/thigh combo... pending on size of puppy at
first... also keeps teeth VERY healty and strong... and white...
toss him an apple to play with and eat for a snack in between...

Sounds like a recipe for malnutrition. But hey, at least you're
feeding
with love!

I agree, I found these instructions for a barf diet disturbing. I
myself fed three dogs a barf diet for about 2 years until I finally
found a kibbled diet that they were able to survive on. They had
horrible food allergies to many different things. I researched my diet
plan for months before I even tried to feed it to them, and then had
frequent bloodwork and other tests done to make sure I wasn't making
them sick. I used raw chicken and/or raw turkey(depending on current
price) and then a vitamin/mineral mix that used various vegetables I
processed myself to make a thick paste. From what I could tell it was
a nutrionally balanced meal, but it took me months of going through
research and comparing vitamin and mineral approximations for various
foods which were used in the paste supplement. Far more work than the
average dog owner would want to go through. Personally I wouldn't
recommend a barf diet unless nothing else was working for the dog.
They are great if done right, but at quite a huge price.

Nick

I dont feed wing tips... thats not a good move...


"diddy" wrote in message
...
in thread : "Drachen"
whittled the following words:

they are sharp when cooked... not when raw...


My puppy swallowed just a wing tip. RAW. It nearly killed him. I'm still
paying off his vet bill, and will be for the next 13 months. I thank my
lucky stars that he survived.
I really appreciate your offering nearly fatal advice. I'd love to sue
people like you!

And another reason I don't have that dogfood in my house is that everytime
my son went to feed the dog, his seizure activity would INCREASe... he'd be
fine the first couple of kibbles, *and this is high end dog food* and then
slowly twitching would come in, and at times he did have full blown
seizures...

allergies? not sure... there were no obvious signs when we had him tested
for it...

Tara wrote in
4.196:

...grain based kibble feels completely
unnatural to feed to obligate cornivores.

The evil speelchucker is Ba-Ack! At least it has a sense of humor.

and with my sons problems, its a price I'm willing and do pay...

I should appologize for my blatancy of the diet, when done properly its easy
to maintain and keep up with... I've been trained for years to know the
vitamins, carbs, etc for majority of the food I eat because of my diabetes,
my sons keto diet and other medical aspects in our household. So it is easy
for me to say, feeding veggies and fruit in general, rather than
specifically mention that I also add various things to the mush and food...

I'm not saying that it was easy, however it did seem in re-reading it that
it sounded like I just toss things together... I'm assuming that most people
will do the research before starting this diet thing, but I realize not
everyone likes to do research. And a lot of people aren't involved in as
much research when they get a dog to begin with... as I mentioned, toss away
animals in another post...





wrote in message
ups.com...

Melinda Shore wrote:
Drachen wrote:
raw chicken... chopped up... and the regular veggies that you eat
yourself... avoid the starches for the most part... but other than
that...
should be easy enough for you to feed him... barely any preperation, a
chicken leg, or thigh, or leg/thigh combo... pending on size of puppy
at
first... also keeps teeth VERY healty and strong... and white...
toss him an apple to play with and eat for a snack in between...


I agree, I found these instructions for a barf diet disturbing. I
myself fed three dogs a barf diet for about 2 years until I finally
found a kibbled diet that they were able to survive on. They had
horrible food allergies to many different things. I researched my diet
plan for months before I even tried to feed it to them, and then had
frequent bloodwork and other tests done to make sure I wasn't making
them sick. I used raw chicken and/or raw turkey(depending on current
price) and then a vitamin/mineral mix that used various vegetables I
processed myself to make a thick paste. From what I could tell it was
a nutrionally balanced meal, but it took me months of going through
research and comparing vitamin and mineral approximations for various
foods which were used in the paste supplement. Far more work than the
average dog owner would want to go through. Personally I wouldn't
recommend a barf diet unless nothing else was working for the dog.
They are great if done right, but at quite a huge price.

Nick

Drachen wrote:
dogs are not vegetarians...
that was doltish... particularily without vet input or breeder input...

The dog was put on vegetarian diet that Peter threw together
based on what he thought would probably work well. It was all
about his feelings, not about the dog. Bloodwork showed up
a number of nutrition-related problems.

our society in general is fast food and preserve years after any expiry
date...

Again, that's not about the dog, that's about your feelings.


no its not... its about tossaway animals and how some people just 'toss them
away'... more particularily its when I randomly went onto another train of
thought...

Dogs don't need carbohydrates the way humans need carbohydrates,
but they do need some and for similar reasons (energy production).
If you completely eliminate carbohydrates you're going to hinder
anaerobic performance, which is something the average pet owner
is probably not going to notice, you're going to hinder brain function,
ditto, and you're not doing the dog any favors. If you don't balance
Omegas 3 and 6 correctly they lose their efficacy against inflammation.
And so on.

Throwing random bits of chicken and fruit at your dog is no
substitute for a complete, balanced diet.

its not random chicken parts... jeepers... didn't you read what I've done...
????? I take my dogs food seriously!!!

anytime we've been on 'dogfood' she doesn't fare as well...

read what I feed her... and yes she gets carbs... just not wheat, nor as
much in the way of potatoes or rice... she does get some though...

I'm not a fluffhead... nor do I think you are sarcastic anti-barf food
individual... with the right supervision, and minor preparations, the barf
diet can work wonderfully...

you'r friend was a dolt...

Whether or not you put the needed work into your dog's food. My issue
is with the instructions you gave to others on how to do. You
essentially said toss meat at them and some veggies and fruit and you
will have a perfectly healthy dog. If someone who doesn't know any
better were to take this advice, you would probably cause a lot of
problems with their dog.

see other posting...
and sincere appologies...

I have dyslexic thought patterns...

point a to point g and i assume people make the leap inbetween... but they
normally don't...



wrote in message
oups.com...

Drachen wrote:
dogs are not vegetarians...
that was doltish... particularily without vet input or breeder input...

The dog was put on vegetarian diet that Peter threw together
based on what he thought would probably work well. It was all
about his feelings, not about the dog. Bloodwork showed up
a number of nutrition-related problems.

our society in general is fast food and preserve years after any
expiry
date...

Again, that's not about the dog, that's about your feelings.


no its not... its about tossaway animals and how some people just 'toss
them
away'... more particularily its when I randomly went onto another train
of
thought...

Dogs don't need carbohydrates the way humans need carbohydrates,
but they do need some and for similar reasons (energy production).
If you completely eliminate carbohydrates you're going to hinder
anaerobic performance, which is something the average pet owner
is probably not going to notice, you're going to hinder brain
function,
ditto, and you're not doing the dog any favors. If you don't balance
Omegas 3 and 6 correctly they lose their efficacy against
inflammation.
And so on.

Throwing random bits of chicken and fruit at your dog is no
substitute for a complete, balanced diet.

its not random chicken parts... jeepers... didn't you read what I've
done...
????? I take my dogs food seriously!!!

anytime we've been on 'dogfood' she doesn't fare as well...

read what I feed her... and yes she gets carbs... just not wheat, nor as
much in the way of potatoes or rice... she does get some though...

I'm not a fluffhead... nor do I think you are sarcastic anti-barf food
individual... with the right supervision, and minor preparations, the
barf
diet can work wonderfully...

you'r friend was a dolt...

Whether or not you put the needed work into your dog's food. My issue
is with the instructions you gave to others on how to do. You
essentially said toss meat at them and some veggies and fruit and you
will have a perfectly healthy dog. If someone who doesn't know any
better were to take this advice, you would probably cause a lot of
problems with their dog.

Shelly wrote:
Janet B wrote in
:

I don't keep track of where I read what for the most part, but
people do recommend whole legs, thighs and wings.

Really?! I must have missed it.

I wouldn't risk it with Lucy. The boys actually chew, so I
think they'd be fine, but Lucy inhales and I would panic about
that. BRAVO is safer for us!

I wouldn't risk legs and thighs, period. Even when raw and well
chewed, those splinters are *sharp*.

--
Shelly
http://www.cat-sidh.net (the Mother Ship)
http://esther.cat-sidh.net (Letters to Esther)

What I tell you three times is true.
-- Lewis Carroll

When I was feeding raw, because of how my dogs ate(they inhaled food as
well) I purchased whole chickens and turkeys. I would then cut it up
myself into small peices. Part of why it took me so much time to do,
and why I stopped as soon as I could find a diet that they worked on.
The veggie paste took about an hour to make and lasted about 2 weeks,
but all that chicken took a lot of time to process down to size by
hand.

Nick