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sound phobia research



 
 
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  #1  
Old May 30th 12, 04:01 PM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior
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Posts: 38
Default sound phobia research

It was summarising this article 'Retrospective analysis of the
treatment of firework fears in dogs', D.S. Mills et al, Veterinary
Record vol 153 no 18, November 1 2003,
for a dog behavior research page
http://www.infopet.co.uk/pages/5032.html
(where the summarized article appears a few articles down), that made
it clear that conditions like SA and 'sound shyness' aren't always
what they appear. Basically, the dogs were defined as sound shy
because their owners said they were. The owners complained because the
dogs barked, or bolted, or showed other behaviors the owners thought
were evidence of sound shyness.

Now my late Rugby was seriously spooked by loud sounds. He' d rush to
a hideyhole and hyperventilate. Conor and his sister Tilly responded
differently They would bark at fireworks or thunder. (They are now
deaf, so no longer respond to thunder.) They may well have been
alerting everyone to potential danger, or threatening whatever made
the noise. They weren't sound-shy. Put them through an obedience
routine, and they forgot the noise. Offer them a piece of kibble and
they sat to attention. Rug in contrast ignored everything except his
fear.

The article looked at DAP, among other treatments. With Conor, the
easiest and most effective solution was to let him know yes, I had
heard him, thanks for telling me there were big bangs going on, then
ask him to lie down next to me and be quiet. Vets offer drugs when
owners diagnose their dogs maybe because owners expect them to, and it
is a way of making money. But it may not always be in the best
interests of the dog, especially if, in Tilly and Conor's case, the
dog isn't really suffering from a condition that some folks might
label them with..

Alison, owner of three mutts

  #2  
Old May 31st 12, 08:58 AM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior
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Posts: 479
Default sound phobia research - LONG

IN this case, you are (fortunately for your dogs) somewhat simplifying
the sound phobia issue. More unease, or announcing, than full blown
phobia.

Yes, some dogs perhaps bark at loud sounds like thunder or fireworks. I
haven't met one yet, but I still have years to go..... My guys don't
bother with dropped pans, crashing cars, sirens, etc., but I know a few
poorly sound- socialized dogs that do.

The ones who are sound phobic demonstrate it in degrees, just like
anything else behavioral. Some do respond well to just the human voice,
some do respond well to some obedience work or a game. I know of dogs
that have crashed through windows during storms.... some that howl as
if the noise causes physical pain.... ones that cower and shake, and may
whine.

A friend's GSD destroyed a wire crate. My boss had a Pharaoh Hound bitch
that headed for the (human's) bathtub during all storms and curled up
there to take a nap. When I lived in tornado alley in Oklahoma, my
terriers seemed to react more to certain wind sounds than to thunder or
lightning, and would go into the inner hallway or the bathroom off that
hall, and flop down. I'd take my flashlight and a book and join them.
They were very good at identifying a tornado within 20 to 24 miles....
Thank God, one never came closer while I lived there. City/county
animal services routinely see a spike in loose dogs after a severe storm
and after all holidays that are fireworks events (July 4th Independence
Day, and New Year's Eve just before and after midnight).

My sound phobic dog, here in Georgia, would have dilated pupils (fear),
tremble (fear), sometimes drool (fear) (talking a Border Terrier here,
not a mastiff or Newfie), and try to climb inside me (fear). (OUCH!) He
would start to ramp up to this before I could hear the thunder, but
sometimes would hear lightning strike static on AM radio.... and would
ramp up Very fast at the sound of fireworks in the neighborhood.

I tried herbals and melatonin orally, dosing in the AM, Rescue Remedy
(homeopathic floral in drinking water or direct oral dose), play or
obedience work with treats, treats if he remained calm after a roll of
thunder (effective only for a few weeks).... to no avail. What worked
for him was wrapping his torso in elastic bandages.... equivalent to the
Anxiety Wrap or Thundershirt. And it worked Fast.... within 2 minutes
of wrapping, he'd be asleep at my feet and was calm all day even with
sporadic fireworks around us. If asked to do so, he could work or play
rather than sleep. It doesn't work for all dogs for all sources of
anxiety. See http://www.anxietywrap.com for the theory....

One vet friend recommends DAP, especially for people who have to work
and leave the dog alone when there is expected to be stormy weather,
fireworks. She says that owners report good to excellent results, at
least when home. Diane dosn't like to use drugs for sound phobia
episodes because by the time a drug given at the beginning or during the
storm/fireworks reaches peak effect, the storm/fireworks are past and
the dog is doped up, but got little or no relief when it was
needed.... And she is seeing similar results with the now readily
available Thundershirt.

With storms, there is debate about whether the dogs initially begin to
react to the drop of barometric pressure immediately before the storm,
or are reacting to the sound of thunder beyond human range, or both.
Some react to the owner's fear. With fireworks, it is apparently the
noise alone. Pain associated with the sounds is possible.... One study
I read somewhere, or perhaps a comment in a book by a behaviorist,
commented that onset of sound phobia, specifically to storms and
fireworks, was generally in the dog's middle age. Not the case with
Schroeder, who was about 5 yo.

Although crating Schroeder in the house did nothing to help during
storms or fireworks, he would remain calm, even doze, in his crate in my
vehicle, if I popped him in there while at the training center. Go
figure..... But vehicles "ground" themselves.....

My Dane, Max, lived for his first four years in Texas... also part of
tornado alley... and was in and out.... had access to the garage if
outside when I was gone. He did have this strange tendency to stand out
in the yard and take a shower during storms, according to my neighbor.
We had storms all year. Then we moved to San Francisco, where we lived
in a suburb, on a ridgeline, so got the full force of wind and rain in
storms coming off the Pacific. In our 3+ years there, we had ONE storm
that included two claps of thunder.... not close.... Max raised his
head and looked around with the first rumble, went back to sleep and
didn't respond to the second rumble, which was a bit louder. The locals
get very excited about thunder and lightning there; it makes the front
page of the paper.....

I have reached the conclusion that sound phobia is multifactoral.... and
LOT more research is needed.

Jo Wolf
Martinez, Georgia, USA

  #3  
Old June 1st 12, 11:48 AM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior
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Posts: 38
Default sound phobia research - LONG

Hello Jo,

You said: (a lot of interesting stuff and)
' I have reached the conclusion that sound phobia is multifactoral....
and a LOT more research is needed. '

Yup. The big problem in the UK used to be fireworks. A fashion
developed for letting them off at any time between late October and
early November. Most animals, including humans, get spooked by sudden
very loud bangs very close to you. It's an instinctive reaction. When
I discussed sound shyness in this group a decade or so ago, it became
clear that Americans have much worse storms.

The reason for describing Tilly and Conor's behavior is that they are
not, and never have been, IMO, sound-phobic, but would be classed as
such in the research article I summarising, which used owners'
definitions, rather than any objective definition. If the owner
complained the dog was sound shy, the dog was included in the study.
Some of the dogs were on psychoactive drugs. It would be daft to dose
Tilly and Conor on psychoactive drugs for behaving in a way that is
pretty normal for a dog, and which could, as you point out, be tackled
by training.

Vets are often seen as experts on dog behavior by owners. But not all
vets are keen enough on dogs to discover what is normal canine
behavior. This shows in some academic vet articles, like the one I
summarized. Just about any experienced dog person could have warned
'hey, your definition of sound shy is a bit lacking in rigor'. That
input would have improved the study. Yes, a LOT more research is
needed, but it might help if people with a lot of practical experience
of dogs, like very experienced trainers, were called in to collaborate
with academics doing this research. Or if very experienced dog people
did their own research projects, helped by academics who could provide
advice on desiging the project, interpreting stats etc. The standard
of research on dogs is improving. Miklosi and his team in Hungary, in
particular, have done some very interesting work. But some vet
articles make you think 'Oh dear', and wonder how much is being funded
by the pharmaceutical industry, just interested in selling its
products ...

Alison, with two now deaf dogs, and one who is a tough cookie and not
too bothered by loud noises

  #4  
Old June 1st 12, 11:55 AM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior
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Posts: 38
Default sound phobia research - LONG

PS fireworks started late Oct, then could carry on until January.
Especially very noisy ones. I hope it is quieter now in the UK! The
other Alison will know.
Alison, who hasn't been back for a while
  #5  
Old June 2nd 12, 04:21 AM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior
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Posts: 479
Default sound phobia research - LONG

The Brits on the Border Terrier list complain about the fireworks every
year, but apparently, the period of time and intensity of noise is
shortening with the economic problems.....

I've found that the general practice vets who are most knowledgeable
about canine behavior issues are Usually those who are active in canine
sports with their own dogs!!!! The most knowledgeable vet-behaviorists
also tend to be active in canine sports/training (such as Patricia
McConnell and Ian Dunbar, here in the US). The vet-behaviorist who used
to be at the vet school here in Georgia would talk to the owners from
here a bit, look at the dog, give them some advice for immediate
management (not treatment), and send them back to my boss.... terrible
with dogs, great with cats, and great with horses! The majority of
these did not have problems that an experienced obedience trainer who
was competent with a wide variety of training methods and variations
couldn't get good results for, training and educating the owners at teh
same time..... This was before drug use spiked. The vets here didn't
like to refer to her.... having known her while in school themselves....
but if the owner insisted.... The new one we haven't had any experience
with yet.

Yes, the work coming out of Hungary recently has been interesting. Did
you know that the study that showed that dogs are right-pawed in about
the same percentage as right handedness in humans? And that one was
done MANY years ago... a generation or two back from most of today's
behavior researchers.

Jo Wolf
Martinez, Georgia, USA

  #6  
Old June 2nd 12, 11:46 AM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior
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Posts: 38
Default sound phobia research - LONG

That's interesting. My mom noticed left and righted pawedness, just
from watching the dogs (she had two, I had 3, and we had canine
visitors). Plus some dogs use their mouths to open doors etc, and
others use paws.

Yes, not all vets have dogs, and some don't even like them - which is
not immediately apparent to a novice owner asking a vet for advice.

It really stands out from living here that a lot of 'behavioral
problems' are linked to culture. Like here people think it normal for
dogs to bark when left alone or when they hear bangs. Anglo owners are
much more likely to say 'my dog's got (SA/ sound shyness etc)' to a
vet or trainer.

Now if you are a young vet in the US, with a mortgage to pay, and not
much experience of dogs, and a client turns up and says 'my dog's got
(reactivity/SA etc) it must be a temptation to say soothing words and
write out a prescription. Client is happy, vet makes money for minimal
work. If you ask about training and exercise, the client may get
defensive, the consultation takes longer, and needs more skill in
terms of making sure client's feelings aren't too ruffled, and you
don't make as much easy money from prescribing drugs. Here, vets
aren't under those pressures, because some conditions like SA are less
common, because of the way dogs are kept, clients are less likely to
diagnose dogs are suffering from psychological problems, and the vets
don't directly sell drugs the way they do in the UK and US.

The 'modern' way of keeping dogs, with much less off-leash freedom,
demands a lot more from owners than the old way. And to some extent,
we create behavioral problems. But, looking at Conor, some degree of
separation anxiety is actually useful. Conor sticks with me when he is
off-leash and gets anxious if he can't sense me around, so I don't
need to worry about him. The littermate most like Conor had no adult
human who took responsibility for him. He was rarely walked. So no
very strong bond or dependence developed between this dog and an adult
human, and he used to take himself for unsupervised walks with no
anxiety. Until he was euthanized at the age of 18 months for biting
people. Conor has learnt that the world is safer when I am around, and
this dependency is what has kept him alive to old age.

Alison, who appreciates her right-hand dog, Conor
  #7  
Old June 3rd 12, 05:50 AM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior
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Posts: 479
Default sound phobia research - LONG

The MDs have fallen into the same drug trap as the vets.....
Prescription of "feel good" drugs is hot and heavy.....

Jo Wolf
Martinez, Georgia, USA

  #8  
Old June 4th 12, 11:09 AM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior
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Posts: 38
Default sound phobia research - LONG

On 3 jun, 06:50, (Jo Wolf) wrote:
The MDs have fallen into the same drug trap as the vets.....
Prescription of "feel good" drugs is hot and heavy.....

Jo Wolf
Martinez, Georgia, USA


Yup. There has been a lot in New Scientist on this recently,
especially the debate in the US on whether some normal behaviors in
kids, like the occasional tantrum, are being medicalized. Similar
pressures apply - parent can feel blameless if the kid or dog is
diagnosed with a medical condition, the parents or owners are more
likely to see the doctor or vet as wise and wonderful if he absolves
them and provides an easy solution, and the pharmaceutical industry
makes pots of money. Those who lose out are the kids and dogs who are
doped up on drugs unnecessarily, rather than getting the parent-
directed, or owner-directed activities that they really need.

Alison, central Spain
 




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