New AKC Agility regs announced

"cimawr" wrote in message
oups.com...

How does the scribe know what the fault was?? Or does the judge have
a different signal for each type of fault, rather than signaling points
(5, 10, 20, E) as they do in NADAC?

There are different hand signals for each fault. A refusal (sigh... ) is a
fist. A wrong course is a hand with fingers/thumb spread. An F is both
hands, fingers/thumb spread. A T (table fault, bouncing on and off the
table) is a T like the timeout signal, using both hands. E's will vary by
judge but is usually waving both hands at waist level. Some judges will have
a sign for "touched your dog" so the handler will know why they were E'd but
not whistled off, That usually happens in novice where the judges don't want
to further overwhelm a handler who is already having issues, when the touch
is minor/inadvertent but still against the rules.
Clear as mud?



And does the scribe actually write down the letter, or are there hash
mark columns for each type? (If the former, I can see where it could
REALLY slow things down when it got the score table, depending on the
scribe's handwriting. G)

The scribe writes the letter. There is a biiiiig empty box and you usually
get the hang of writing without looking. The only problems occur when there
is fault after fault after fault... at that point, I'll look down
occasionally to make sure I'm still writing in the box and not elsewhere on
the sheet - if I miss an R after five Fs, it isn't an issue. You do have to
make sure you are writing reasonably legibly, though, as in Nov/Open you can
still qualify with some faults, and if your F looks like an R or vice versa,
it can affect the results.


Erm. My brain parsed that as meaning that the scribe was writing down
the time when the fault occurred... then common sense took over, and
told me you meant the scribe writes down the dog's time at the end of
the run. :-D

Yup, sorry. Fortunately there isn't a requirement for documenting the exact
time each fault occurred, though I wouldn't have put it past AKC... hee hee.

Yes, that's extremely frustrating. Most of the time I know coming
off the course what went wrong, but every now and then I have a mystery
fault, which I *hate* - I don't like having a fault and not knowing
why.

Yep, and if you think you're clean and find out you were marked down as
NQing, and nobody remembers and no one saw it happen, well, it is
frustrating. Then again, going through a lovely JWW run and thinking you
Q'ed but maybe got a refusal, and asking friends if the R got called, and
finding out no, but the knocked last bar did.... ARGH. So hey, there's
always gonna be frustration!

Christy

cimawr wrote:
Robin Nuttall wrote:



Now, here's a curiosity question: How are scores marked on AKC score
sheets? And how are they entered in the software?

Score sheets are given letters for errors--R, W, T, F, E. That happens
as the run is going, then the time is written on the sheet and it's
handed to the secretary. The secretary writes the SCT on the sheet, adds
up the errors (5 pts per error,) or in some cases just circles NQ. How
it's put into the software depends on the software used.

Since this is done as the class is running, the score sheets are
usually printed out, and posted, within 5-15 minutes of the end of the
class.

Generally the placements are ready before the judge actually reviews the
sheets, but ribbons cannot be awarded until then. And unlike NADAC,
where it's a "look at the sheet and serve yourself" thing, in AKC we
generally print stickers for the backs of ribbons that are placed on
each one with the dog's name, score, placement, MACH points, etc. This
can be used as an official way to get a score corrected if AKC screws it
up. But even with that, ribbons are generally finished within 15-20 minutes.


Also, just out of curiosity, do AKC clubs in your area use assistant
scribes? A few years ago, we* had to teach one AKC club about that
method the first time they put on a NADAC trial; it was *amazing* how
much faster things went the second day, when they'd got the hang of it.

Generally the assistant scribe and timer are a combined position now
that the timers are electronic.

cimawr wrote:

Robin Nuttall wrote:


Meant to ask - again, simply because I'm curious - what time did you
start?

Me? I was there at 6. The trial started at 8.

I was thinking if you divided the time in half, then added that on,
you'd get a rough idea of how long it would take to run 3 classes -
which in the case of your club, would be a lot earlier than midnight,
I'm sure! G

Yeah, but still way too long for a single judge 2 ring trial.

The ones put
on by breed clubs or obed. clubs, especially those who are looking at
agility as money-maker, are the ones that are more likely to be badly
run - and I'm sure those are the sort that the on-list groaners were
referring to.

Oh yeah. Most agility clubs do a great job though as you know at any
trial, sh*t can happen. There is a club that I will NOT go to though--a
breed club, their show was an utter disaster. Novice people were there
till something like 8:00 p.m. The next year, ribbons weren't even
available on Saturday for Saturday's winners, and the trial secretaries
were on site till 1:00 a.m. Um, thanks no.



Also (again, just because I'm curious from a statistical point of
view) how many runs/dogs was your trial?

330 and we were full. So 165 Standard, 165 Jumpers.


The really quick ones are also divided into large dog and small dog
rings, which speeds things up because you have less jump height
changes. Last outdoor trial I went to, Rocsi was the *only* 12" dog in
Elite, because I was assigned to the large dog ring. I don't think
you could do that with an AKC trial, at least not at the Excellent
level, since it would skew the MACH-points-via-placement thing,
wouldn't it?

No, it wouldn't skew MACH points. I do know some trials do all Excellent
under one judge, and all Open and Novice under another. But we don't
have 2 full rings of Standard equipment, and probably never will.

cimawr wrote:


How does the scribe know what the fault was?? Or does the judge have
a different signal for each type of fault, rather than signaling points
(5, 10, 20, E) as they do in NADAC?

Exactly. All signals are with raised hands. A single closed fist is a
Refusal (R). A single open hand, fingers spread, is a Wrong course (W).
Two hands held up in that manner is a Failure (F). Table faults (T) are
generally signalled with the judge holding up 2 fingers like a peace
sign, but some use the sports world's Time Out signal. An Excusal is
marked by a whistle blow.
And does the scribe actually write down the letter, or are there hash
mark columns for each type? (If the former, I can see where it could
REALLY slow things down when it got the score table, depending on the
scribe's handwriting. G)

The scribe writes the letter. And actually I've never seen it illegible.
If it's a class where a dog can Q with points off (Open and Novice),
the points are added, but in Excellent, any letter just gets the
Non-Qualifying words circled. The time is always recorded in case of
time faults. But trust me, the scoretable can well keep up with the class.

"cimawr" said in rec.pets.dogs.activities:

How does the scribe know what the fault was?? Or does the
judge have a different signal for each type of fault,
rather than signaling points (5, 10, 20, E) as they do in
NADAC?

In AAC, judges use some differentiation in signals. For
example, an open hand is 5 faults and a closed fist is a refusal
and is marked on the scribe sheet as an 'R' even though it's
still 5 faults.

In gamblers and snooker, I've started calling "zero" for
obstacles not performed - this gives the handler a clear
indication that they've missed something and makes it easier for
me to remember the sequence if the handler has a question later.

--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.

Rocky wrote:
"cimawr" said in rec.pets.dogs.activities:


In AAC, judges use some differentiation in signals. For
example, an open hand is 5 faults and a closed fist is a refusal
and is marked on the scribe sheet as an 'R' even though it's
still 5 faults.

Right. All faults in AKC except for failure or elimination are 5-faults.
The table fault used to be 2, which is why a lot of judges put up 2
fingers. But a table fault is also now 5. F and E are eliminations.

In gamblers and snooker, I've started calling "zero" for
obstacles not performed - this gives the handler a clear
indication that they've missed something and makes it easier for
me to remember the sequence if the handler has a question later.


When I did NADAC I always appreciated that. I really cannot wait to try
the FAST class!