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For Jerry : question about lead walking and sniffing!



 
 
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  #1  
Old June 2nd 04, 08:43 AM
James Agnew
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default For Jerry : question about lead walking and sniffing!

Hi Jerry

Have been reading and following your manual and am getting some great
results :-)

I have a question concerning lead walking and sniffing that I hope you
could answer.

I'm training my 15 week pup to walk politely on the lead and I've been
following your advice about releasing the pressure the minute she
starts tugging. The problem is that when we try this, she always
starts sniffing the ground or tugs in front or behind me. I'm against
tugging or even holding tension in the lead so what's the best way to
get her to come back to the starting position so we can try again?

As I understand it, she shouldn't believe that her tugging has
allowed her to gain ground (hence returning to the spot where she
first tugged), but I'm having difficulty preventing her from sniffing
the ground and I DON'T wont to be pulling/lifting her up with the lead
and collar. I'm currently using the shaker can to distract her from
sniffing - I create the sounds from different directions and always in
such a way that she's distracted (never startled or frightened) - but
it seems that she's becoming 'selectively deaf' to the various sounds!

Any suggestions?

Thanks as always, James
  #2  
Old June 2nd 04, 09:36 AM
Paul B
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"James Agnew" wrote in message
om...
Hi Jerry

Have been reading and following your manual and am getting some great
results :-)


Hi James,

I have read and used Jerry's method over several years so I'll offer my
advice.

I have a question concerning lead walking and sniffing that I hope you
could answer.

I'm training my 15 week pup to walk politely on the lead and I've been
following your advice about releasing the pressure the minute she
starts tugging. The problem is that when we try this, she always
starts sniffing the ground or tugs in front or behind me. I'm against
tugging or even holding tension in the lead so what's the best way to
get her to come back to the starting position so we can try again?

As I understand it, she shouldn't believe that her tugging has
allowed her to gain ground (hence returning to the spot where she
first tugged),


Thats not part of the training, dogs don't tend to project or reflect like
that, dogs aren't thinking of gaining ground when tugging they simply want
to explore and have no respect for the lead or the handler.

but I'm having difficulty preventing her from sniffing
the ground and I DON'T wont to be pulling/lifting her up with the lead
and collar. I'm currently using the shaker can to distract her from
sniffing - I create the sounds from different directions and always in
such a way that she's distracted (never startled or frightened) - but
it seems that she's becoming 'selectively deaf' to the various sounds!


Probably your timing is wrong and / or your not getting the dogs attention
with the "immediate" praise.

Any suggestions?


There are 2 other things you can do, both to teach you to command the dogs
attention and to teach the dog to pay you attention.

The first thing is to ask for a "heel", a stationary heel, stay where you
are and ask the dog to heel, "dog heel, good dog", insist on an exact heel
too, not a squif heel but square on, then stay in that position for a while
(30 seconds) then as you move forward ask the dog to heel (moving forward
with your left leg). Repeat this a few times each time the dog forges
forward but if say after 4 times the dog is still not playing ball then do
the figure 8. Ask the dog to heel again ( stationary heel), once the dog is
heeling beside you do the figure 8 heel as described in the manual, I walk
around the dog (i.e the dog is on my left so I walk a 180deg circle to my
left) then get the dog to walk around me (I walk a 180 deg circle to my
right), the dog has to heel all during the exercise. It seems like an odd
concept but it works very well, it tends to take the dogs mind off
distractions and focus on what you want, I have found if the dog/s don't
settle after one figure 8 then another or even another always settles things
down, it seems to create a patnership where you are walking together. I use
the technique walking 2 dogs together, nothing really changes, when you get
confident try it without using a leash it works the same, you just have to
learn to get the dogs attention and hold it. No treats, no remote controls.

Paul




Thanks as always, James



  #3  
Old June 2nd 04, 09:36 AM
Paul B
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"James Agnew" wrote in message
om...
Hi Jerry

Have been reading and following your manual and am getting some great
results :-)


Hi James,

I have read and used Jerry's method over several years so I'll offer my
advice.

I have a question concerning lead walking and sniffing that I hope you
could answer.

I'm training my 15 week pup to walk politely on the lead and I've been
following your advice about releasing the pressure the minute she
starts tugging. The problem is that when we try this, she always
starts sniffing the ground or tugs in front or behind me. I'm against
tugging or even holding tension in the lead so what's the best way to
get her to come back to the starting position so we can try again?

As I understand it, she shouldn't believe that her tugging has
allowed her to gain ground (hence returning to the spot where she
first tugged),


Thats not part of the training, dogs don't tend to project or reflect like
that, dogs aren't thinking of gaining ground when tugging they simply want
to explore and have no respect for the lead or the handler.

but I'm having difficulty preventing her from sniffing
the ground and I DON'T wont to be pulling/lifting her up with the lead
and collar. I'm currently using the shaker can to distract her from
sniffing - I create the sounds from different directions and always in
such a way that she's distracted (never startled or frightened) - but
it seems that she's becoming 'selectively deaf' to the various sounds!


Probably your timing is wrong and / or your not getting the dogs attention
with the "immediate" praise.

Any suggestions?


There are 2 other things you can do, both to teach you to command the dogs
attention and to teach the dog to pay you attention.

The first thing is to ask for a "heel", a stationary heel, stay where you
are and ask the dog to heel, "dog heel, good dog", insist on an exact heel
too, not a squif heel but square on, then stay in that position for a while
(30 seconds) then as you move forward ask the dog to heel (moving forward
with your left leg). Repeat this a few times each time the dog forges
forward but if say after 4 times the dog is still not playing ball then do
the figure 8. Ask the dog to heel again ( stationary heel), once the dog is
heeling beside you do the figure 8 heel as described in the manual, I walk
around the dog (i.e the dog is on my left so I walk a 180deg circle to my
left) then get the dog to walk around me (I walk a 180 deg circle to my
right), the dog has to heel all during the exercise. It seems like an odd
concept but it works very well, it tends to take the dogs mind off
distractions and focus on what you want, I have found if the dog/s don't
settle after one figure 8 then another or even another always settles things
down, it seems to create a patnership where you are walking together. I use
the technique walking 2 dogs together, nothing really changes, when you get
confident try it without using a leash it works the same, you just have to
learn to get the dogs attention and hold it. No treats, no remote controls.

Paul




Thanks as always, James



  #4  
Old June 2nd 04, 09:36 AM
Paul B
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"James Agnew" wrote in message
om...
Hi Jerry

Have been reading and following your manual and am getting some great
results :-)


Hi James,

I have read and used Jerry's method over several years so I'll offer my
advice.

I have a question concerning lead walking and sniffing that I hope you
could answer.

I'm training my 15 week pup to walk politely on the lead and I've been
following your advice about releasing the pressure the minute she
starts tugging. The problem is that when we try this, she always
starts sniffing the ground or tugs in front or behind me. I'm against
tugging or even holding tension in the lead so what's the best way to
get her to come back to the starting position so we can try again?

As I understand it, she shouldn't believe that her tugging has
allowed her to gain ground (hence returning to the spot where she
first tugged),


Thats not part of the training, dogs don't tend to project or reflect like
that, dogs aren't thinking of gaining ground when tugging they simply want
to explore and have no respect for the lead or the handler.

but I'm having difficulty preventing her from sniffing
the ground and I DON'T wont to be pulling/lifting her up with the lead
and collar. I'm currently using the shaker can to distract her from
sniffing - I create the sounds from different directions and always in
such a way that she's distracted (never startled or frightened) - but
it seems that she's becoming 'selectively deaf' to the various sounds!


Probably your timing is wrong and / or your not getting the dogs attention
with the "immediate" praise.

Any suggestions?


There are 2 other things you can do, both to teach you to command the dogs
attention and to teach the dog to pay you attention.

The first thing is to ask for a "heel", a stationary heel, stay where you
are and ask the dog to heel, "dog heel, good dog", insist on an exact heel
too, not a squif heel but square on, then stay in that position for a while
(30 seconds) then as you move forward ask the dog to heel (moving forward
with your left leg). Repeat this a few times each time the dog forges
forward but if say after 4 times the dog is still not playing ball then do
the figure 8. Ask the dog to heel again ( stationary heel), once the dog is
heeling beside you do the figure 8 heel as described in the manual, I walk
around the dog (i.e the dog is on my left so I walk a 180deg circle to my
left) then get the dog to walk around me (I walk a 180 deg circle to my
right), the dog has to heel all during the exercise. It seems like an odd
concept but it works very well, it tends to take the dogs mind off
distractions and focus on what you want, I have found if the dog/s don't
settle after one figure 8 then another or even another always settles things
down, it seems to create a patnership where you are walking together. I use
the technique walking 2 dogs together, nothing really changes, when you get
confident try it without using a leash it works the same, you just have to
learn to get the dogs attention and hold it. No treats, no remote controls.

Paul




Thanks as always, James



  #5  
Old June 2nd 04, 01:03 PM
James Agnew
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Hi Paul

but I'm having difficulty preventing her from sniffing
the ground and I DON'T wont to be pulling/lifting her up with the lead
and collar. I'm currently using the shaker can to distract her from
sniffing - I create the sounds from different directions and always in
such a way that she's distracted (never startled or frightened) - but
it seems that she's becoming 'selectively deaf' to the various sounds!


Probably your timing is wrong and / or your not getting the dogs attention
with the "immediate" praise.


You're probably right, although I do try to distract her the moment she's
tempted to lower her head to sniff some grass, rather than when she's in
mid-sniff. I know she *hears* the noise (I see her ears twitch), and I do
follow-up with immediate praise but she won't always stop what she's doing.

Any suggestions?


There are 2 other things you can do, both to teach you to command the dogs
attention and to teach the dog to pay you attention.

The first thing is to ask for a "heel", a stationary heel, stay where you
are and ask the dog to heel, "dog heel, good dog", insist on an exact heel
too, not a squif heel but square on, then stay in that position for a

while
(30 seconds) then as you move forward ask the dog to heel (moving forward
with your left leg). Repeat this a few times each time the dog forges
forward


This is interesting. So, if she's in the standing still heel position to my
side and I move forward, what should I do if she lunges forward, straining
on the lead, even after the first or second stride? My initial reaction is
to stop, and wait until she stop pulling. If she does, I'll invite her to
come back to my side and heel and repeat the process. If she doesn't stop
pulling, my reaction is to relieve tension in the lead but this will often
cause her to pull further forward!

Thanks for your help Paul,

James



  #6  
Old June 2nd 04, 01:03 PM
James Agnew
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Hi Paul

but I'm having difficulty preventing her from sniffing
the ground and I DON'T wont to be pulling/lifting her up with the lead
and collar. I'm currently using the shaker can to distract her from
sniffing - I create the sounds from different directions and always in
such a way that she's distracted (never startled or frightened) - but
it seems that she's becoming 'selectively deaf' to the various sounds!


Probably your timing is wrong and / or your not getting the dogs attention
with the "immediate" praise.


You're probably right, although I do try to distract her the moment she's
tempted to lower her head to sniff some grass, rather than when she's in
mid-sniff. I know she *hears* the noise (I see her ears twitch), and I do
follow-up with immediate praise but she won't always stop what she's doing.

Any suggestions?


There are 2 other things you can do, both to teach you to command the dogs
attention and to teach the dog to pay you attention.

The first thing is to ask for a "heel", a stationary heel, stay where you
are and ask the dog to heel, "dog heel, good dog", insist on an exact heel
too, not a squif heel but square on, then stay in that position for a

while
(30 seconds) then as you move forward ask the dog to heel (moving forward
with your left leg). Repeat this a few times each time the dog forges
forward


This is interesting. So, if she's in the standing still heel position to my
side and I move forward, what should I do if she lunges forward, straining
on the lead, even after the first or second stride? My initial reaction is
to stop, and wait until she stop pulling. If she does, I'll invite her to
come back to my side and heel and repeat the process. If she doesn't stop
pulling, my reaction is to relieve tension in the lead but this will often
cause her to pull further forward!

Thanks for your help Paul,

James



  #7  
Old June 2nd 04, 01:03 PM
James Agnew
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Hi Paul

but I'm having difficulty preventing her from sniffing
the ground and I DON'T wont to be pulling/lifting her up with the lead
and collar. I'm currently using the shaker can to distract her from
sniffing - I create the sounds from different directions and always in
such a way that she's distracted (never startled or frightened) - but
it seems that she's becoming 'selectively deaf' to the various sounds!


Probably your timing is wrong and / or your not getting the dogs attention
with the "immediate" praise.


You're probably right, although I do try to distract her the moment she's
tempted to lower her head to sniff some grass, rather than when she's in
mid-sniff. I know she *hears* the noise (I see her ears twitch), and I do
follow-up with immediate praise but she won't always stop what she's doing.

Any suggestions?


There are 2 other things you can do, both to teach you to command the dogs
attention and to teach the dog to pay you attention.

The first thing is to ask for a "heel", a stationary heel, stay where you
are and ask the dog to heel, "dog heel, good dog", insist on an exact heel
too, not a squif heel but square on, then stay in that position for a

while
(30 seconds) then as you move forward ask the dog to heel (moving forward
with your left leg). Repeat this a few times each time the dog forges
forward


This is interesting. So, if she's in the standing still heel position to my
side and I move forward, what should I do if she lunges forward, straining
on the lead, even after the first or second stride? My initial reaction is
to stop, and wait until she stop pulling. If she does, I'll invite her to
come back to my side and heel and repeat the process. If she doesn't stop
pulling, my reaction is to relieve tension in the lead but this will often
cause her to pull further forward!

Thanks for your help Paul,

James



  #8  
Old June 3rd 04, 11:04 AM
Paul B
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"James Agnew" wrote in message
...
Hi Paul

but I'm having difficulty preventing her from sniffing
the ground and I DON'T wont to be pulling/lifting her up with the lead
and collar. I'm currently using the shaker can to distract her from
sniffing - I create the sounds from different directions and always in
such a way that she's distracted (never startled or frightened) - but
it seems that she's becoming 'selectively deaf' to the various sounds!


Probably your timing is wrong and / or your not getting the dogs

attention
with the "immediate" praise.


You're probably right, although I do try to distract her the moment she's
tempted to lower her head to sniff some grass, rather than when she's in
mid-sniff. I know she *hears* the noise (I see her ears twitch), and I do
follow-up with immediate praise but she won't always stop what she's

doing.

Any suggestions?


The very split second she goes to sniff is the time to distract, watch her
like a hawk and as soon as she makes the first inkling of breaking the heel
distract her.


There are 2 other things you can do, both to teach you to command the

dogs
attention and to teach the dog to pay you attention.

The first thing is to ask for a "heel", a stationary heel, stay where

you
are and ask the dog to heel, "dog heel, good dog", insist on an exact

heel
too, not a squif heel but square on, then stay in that position for a

while
(30 seconds) then as you move forward ask the dog to heel (moving

forward
with your left leg). Repeat this a few times each time the dog forges
forward


This is interesting. So, if she's in the standing still heel position to

my
side and I move forward, what should I do if she lunges forward, straining
on the lead, even after the first or second stride? My initial reaction is
to stop, and wait until she stop pulling.


Your allowing tension on the leash and allowing the dog to decide when to
stop pulling, you are in control of the walk, if the dog isn't doing what
you want then ask it to something you know it will do, ie a recall or return
to heel.

Best if you ask for a return to heel (stationary heel) and ask the dog to
sit too, that will help relax things, but it sounds like shes just waiting
to go, she may be heeling at your side but her focus is not on you but what
shes going to do soon as shes allowed to move, thats why I ask the dogs to
heel beside me for say 30 seconds or whatever, wait untill the dog is
settled and no longer just focusing on going forward but rather relaxed and
calm. The problem is the dog often anticipates and soon as you make a move
to walk the dog is already there walking ahead, so one way to stop the
anticipation is to take one step forward from the stationary heel, as you
step forward ask the dog to heel then immediately stop and ask for a sit,
this throws the dog off kilter and as you may see the dog is obliged to keep
an eye on you to see if you are going to proceed or stop so it has to pay
you attention. The dog can no longer accurately anticipate your move.
Another trick is to move off extremely slowly, walk at a real snails pace
and insist the dog heels beside you, I have found this very effective with
my dogs, I'm not sure exactly why it works possibly because a real slow pace
is somewhere between a stop and a walk and the dogs are unsure what to make
of it.

If she does, I'll invite her to
come back to my side and heel and repeat the process. If she doesn't stop
pulling, my reaction is to relieve tension in the lead but this will often
cause her to pull further forward!


Shes not focusing on you at all in that case, try heading off in the
opposite direction the dog thinks you are going to go, so you are standing
still with the dog sitting at heel beside you, typically you would move
forward and ask the dog to heel as you do so, but this time as you move do a
180 degree turn to your right so you are walking back from where you just
came, and as you do so ask the dog to heel. Use the heeling pattern exercise
in the manual, that works as it stops the dog anticipating, just as the dog
thinks it knows where your heading your off in a different direction, the
dog has to pay attention to keep up.


Thanks for your help Paul,

Hope it helps

Paul

James





  #9  
Old June 3rd 04, 11:04 AM
Paul B
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"James Agnew" wrote in message
...
Hi Paul

but I'm having difficulty preventing her from sniffing
the ground and I DON'T wont to be pulling/lifting her up with the lead
and collar. I'm currently using the shaker can to distract her from
sniffing - I create the sounds from different directions and always in
such a way that she's distracted (never startled or frightened) - but
it seems that she's becoming 'selectively deaf' to the various sounds!


Probably your timing is wrong and / or your not getting the dogs

attention
with the "immediate" praise.


You're probably right, although I do try to distract her the moment she's
tempted to lower her head to sniff some grass, rather than when she's in
mid-sniff. I know she *hears* the noise (I see her ears twitch), and I do
follow-up with immediate praise but she won't always stop what she's

doing.

Any suggestions?


The very split second she goes to sniff is the time to distract, watch her
like a hawk and as soon as she makes the first inkling of breaking the heel
distract her.


There are 2 other things you can do, both to teach you to command the

dogs
attention and to teach the dog to pay you attention.

The first thing is to ask for a "heel", a stationary heel, stay where

you
are and ask the dog to heel, "dog heel, good dog", insist on an exact

heel
too, not a squif heel but square on, then stay in that position for a

while
(30 seconds) then as you move forward ask the dog to heel (moving

forward
with your left leg). Repeat this a few times each time the dog forges
forward


This is interesting. So, if she's in the standing still heel position to

my
side and I move forward, what should I do if she lunges forward, straining
on the lead, even after the first or second stride? My initial reaction is
to stop, and wait until she stop pulling.


Your allowing tension on the leash and allowing the dog to decide when to
stop pulling, you are in control of the walk, if the dog isn't doing what
you want then ask it to something you know it will do, ie a recall or return
to heel.

Best if you ask for a return to heel (stationary heel) and ask the dog to
sit too, that will help relax things, but it sounds like shes just waiting
to go, she may be heeling at your side but her focus is not on you but what
shes going to do soon as shes allowed to move, thats why I ask the dogs to
heel beside me for say 30 seconds or whatever, wait untill the dog is
settled and no longer just focusing on going forward but rather relaxed and
calm. The problem is the dog often anticipates and soon as you make a move
to walk the dog is already there walking ahead, so one way to stop the
anticipation is to take one step forward from the stationary heel, as you
step forward ask the dog to heel then immediately stop and ask for a sit,
this throws the dog off kilter and as you may see the dog is obliged to keep
an eye on you to see if you are going to proceed or stop so it has to pay
you attention. The dog can no longer accurately anticipate your move.
Another trick is to move off extremely slowly, walk at a real snails pace
and insist the dog heels beside you, I have found this very effective with
my dogs, I'm not sure exactly why it works possibly because a real slow pace
is somewhere between a stop and a walk and the dogs are unsure what to make
of it.

If she does, I'll invite her to
come back to my side and heel and repeat the process. If she doesn't stop
pulling, my reaction is to relieve tension in the lead but this will often
cause her to pull further forward!


Shes not focusing on you at all in that case, try heading off in the
opposite direction the dog thinks you are going to go, so you are standing
still with the dog sitting at heel beside you, typically you would move
forward and ask the dog to heel as you do so, but this time as you move do a
180 degree turn to your right so you are walking back from where you just
came, and as you do so ask the dog to heel. Use the heeling pattern exercise
in the manual, that works as it stops the dog anticipating, just as the dog
thinks it knows where your heading your off in a different direction, the
dog has to pay attention to keep up.


Thanks for your help Paul,

Hope it helps

Paul

James





  #10  
Old June 3rd 04, 11:04 AM
Paul B
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"James Agnew" wrote in message
...
Hi Paul

but I'm having difficulty preventing her from sniffing
the ground and I DON'T wont to be pulling/lifting her up with the lead
and collar. I'm currently using the shaker can to distract her from
sniffing - I create the sounds from different directions and always in
such a way that she's distracted (never startled or frightened) - but
it seems that she's becoming 'selectively deaf' to the various sounds!


Probably your timing is wrong and / or your not getting the dogs

attention
with the "immediate" praise.


You're probably right, although I do try to distract her the moment she's
tempted to lower her head to sniff some grass, rather than when she's in
mid-sniff. I know she *hears* the noise (I see her ears twitch), and I do
follow-up with immediate praise but she won't always stop what she's

doing.

Any suggestions?


The very split second she goes to sniff is the time to distract, watch her
like a hawk and as soon as she makes the first inkling of breaking the heel
distract her.


There are 2 other things you can do, both to teach you to command the

dogs
attention and to teach the dog to pay you attention.

The first thing is to ask for a "heel", a stationary heel, stay where

you
are and ask the dog to heel, "dog heel, good dog", insist on an exact

heel
too, not a squif heel but square on, then stay in that position for a

while
(30 seconds) then as you move forward ask the dog to heel (moving

forward
with your left leg). Repeat this a few times each time the dog forges
forward


This is interesting. So, if she's in the standing still heel position to

my
side and I move forward, what should I do if she lunges forward, straining
on the lead, even after the first or second stride? My initial reaction is
to stop, and wait until she stop pulling.


Your allowing tension on the leash and allowing the dog to decide when to
stop pulling, you are in control of the walk, if the dog isn't doing what
you want then ask it to something you know it will do, ie a recall or return
to heel.

Best if you ask for a return to heel (stationary heel) and ask the dog to
sit too, that will help relax things, but it sounds like shes just waiting
to go, she may be heeling at your side but her focus is not on you but what
shes going to do soon as shes allowed to move, thats why I ask the dogs to
heel beside me for say 30 seconds or whatever, wait untill the dog is
settled and no longer just focusing on going forward but rather relaxed and
calm. The problem is the dog often anticipates and soon as you make a move
to walk the dog is already there walking ahead, so one way to stop the
anticipation is to take one step forward from the stationary heel, as you
step forward ask the dog to heel then immediately stop and ask for a sit,
this throws the dog off kilter and as you may see the dog is obliged to keep
an eye on you to see if you are going to proceed or stop so it has to pay
you attention. The dog can no longer accurately anticipate your move.
Another trick is to move off extremely slowly, walk at a real snails pace
and insist the dog heels beside you, I have found this very effective with
my dogs, I'm not sure exactly why it works possibly because a real slow pace
is somewhere between a stop and a walk and the dogs are unsure what to make
of it.

If she does, I'll invite her to
come back to my side and heel and repeat the process. If she doesn't stop
pulling, my reaction is to relieve tension in the lead but this will often
cause her to pull further forward!


Shes not focusing on you at all in that case, try heading off in the
opposite direction the dog thinks you are going to go, so you are standing
still with the dog sitting at heel beside you, typically you would move
forward and ask the dog to heel as you do so, but this time as you move do a
180 degree turn to your right so you are walking back from where you just
came, and as you do so ask the dog to heel. Use the heeling pattern exercise
in the manual, that works as it stops the dog anticipating, just as the dog
thinks it knows where your heading your off in a different direction, the
dog has to pay attention to keep up.


Thanks for your help Paul,

Hope it helps

Paul

James





 




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Lead training pup (quite long) Lynda Dog behavior 0 May 15th 04 12:55 PM
Lead training pup (quite long) Lynda Dog behavior 0 May 15th 04 12:55 PM
Lead training pup (quite long) Lynda Dog behavior 0 May 15th 04 12:55 PM


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