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Dog IQ Contest and/or Elder Dog Contest?



 
 
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  #1  
Old October 20th 03, 02:42 AM
Scott T. Jensen
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Default Dog IQ Contest and/or Elder Dog Contest?

Is there a dog contest(s) that judges how smart the dogs are? Dogs are
breed for so many things. How about for intelligence?

Also, are there dog contest(s) that judge dogs when they're within the last
year of their expected lifespans? Judging them on how well they aged.

Scott Jensen
--
Peer-to-peer networking (a.k.a. file-sharing) is entertainment's future.
If you'd like to know why, read the white paper at the link below.
http://www.nonesuch.org/p2prevolution.pdf



  #2  
Old October 20th 03, 03:42 AM
Jo Wolf
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And also....

Function: The breed developed to man-trail by scent, such as the
bloodhound, will be much better at it than, say, a breed developed as a
lap dog. Which dog is more intelligent? If you are rating
man-trailing, the Bloodhound wins hands down. But within all
Bloodhounds, some will be better than others. Which dog is more
intelligent? A Labrador Retriever may chase a small critter and try to
dig it out of it's den, to no avail, but lots of fun and destruction...
but a terrier, bred for the job, enlarges the den slightly and either
chases the ritter out the back door or kills it and usually drags it
out. Which dog is more intelligent? The Lab retrieves all day, works
as a scent detection dog, works as a guide dog, works as an assistance
dog.... but as a dog trying to do terrier work, it's a bomb.... (Note
that many terriers can and will do water retrieve work even field
retrieves, and can do certain types of assistance dog work within it's
size capacity... but isn' t big enough to be a guide dog, and won't do
many of the Lab's jobs as well as the Lab does them.)

It's easiest to rate "intelligence" against the standards for formal
obedience trials... happens every weekend at those trials, but it's the
individual dog and it's trainer (usually the owner), not the breed, that
is measured.

Old Dogs: At some dog shows, and almost always at the single-breed
shows called "specialties", there is competition for "veterans", dogs 8
years old and older.... They are measured against the breed standard,
the same way the young dogs are... and one of those measures is gait...
how the dog moves. I have seen a number of 14 and 15year-old dogs in
these veterans classes who would still be competitive in the regular
classes of younger dogs, except that they move more stiffly, and maybe
more slowly. They can also compete in veterans classes in obedience,
where they are not asked to jump or retrieve. In terriers, a good
number of veterans (by calendar age) compete with the younger dogs with
no breaks, in Earthdog tests. In agility, the AKC has one group of
classes with lower jumps, aimed originally at the older dog. My dogs
have worked as therapy dogs up to and past their 15th birthdays. My
present 11 yo terrier is more active than my current 6 yo terrier, and
learns new things faster than the 6 yo.... same breed, different dogs.

Jo Wolf
Martinez, Georgia

  #3  
Old October 20th 03, 03:43 AM
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On Sun, 19 Oct 2003 20:42:21 -0500 Scott T. Jensen whittled these words:
Is there a dog contest(s) that judges how smart the dogs are? Dogs are
breed for so many things. How about for intelligence?


There are ways of evaluating various aspects of intelligence but its a
very broad a concept. Is a dog that knows what is wanted but chooses not
to comply unless you make it worth his while more or less intelligent than
the dog that slavishly follows every command? Is the dog that learns one
way that is successful and then carefully continues to use that way
everytime more or less intelligent than the dog that experiments to see if
another way might also work? Dogs ARE bred for certain aspects of
intelligence. People who are serious about competing in the sport of
obedience look for their puppies from pedigrees with success in obedience.
Search and rescue handlers prefer dogs that come from a proven background
of search and rescue. Great obedience dogs have the ability to learn a
large number of commands, to understand those commands in two "languages"
(voice and hand signal), and the will to perform them flawlessly. But a
great obedience dog need not be a great problem solver. And a great
problem solver might not be able to retain and execute the various
obedience commands. Then there is the whole problem of separateing out
what is inate (and thus can be bred for) vs. what is learned (and is
therefore not very useful in breeding selection). This is basically true
of humans as well - so called "intelligence tests" often measure
accomplishment, not ability.


Also, are there dog contest(s) that judge dogs when they're within the last
year of their expected lifespans? Judging them on how well they aged.


No. There are, for some breeds, registries of longevity. There are, for
some breeds, health registries. Getting people to submit the information
even once takes a lot of persuasion. Since no one knows that would be the
last year of an expected lifespan data collection would have to be
continuous. I don't know of many breeds that have just a single age as an
"expected lifespan" Even those with the shortest life spans "normal" is a
range of two or three years, e.g. a labrador retriever typical lives 10-12
years. Even the term "typical lifespan" is misleading as longevity
studies will tend to show significant differences depending upon many
factors, including the "line" (pedigree). Even human cultural
differences will influence typical lifespan depending upon whether the use
and level of veterinary care. Again its as difficult in dogs as it is in
people to separate out what is due to genetics and what is environmental -
and there is a lot less money incentive behind finding out.

Diane Blackman


  #4  
Old October 20th 03, 08:05 AM
Scott T. Jensen
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Default

wrote:
But a great obedience dog need not be a great
problem solver. And a great problem solver
might not be able to retain and execute the
various obedience commands.


I was thinking along the lines of a problem-solver. Dogs given problems
that were not revealed to their owners/trainers before the contest to see
how they do.

Scott Jensen
--
Peer-to-peer networking (a.k.a. file-sharing) is entertainment's future.
If you'd like to know why, read the white paper at the link below.
http://www.nonesuch.org/p2prevolution.pdf


  #5  
Old October 20th 03, 08:08 AM
Scott T. Jensen
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"Jo Wolf" wrote:
Old Dogs: At some dog shows, and almost always at the
single-breed shows called "specialties", there is competition
for "veterans", dogs 8 years old and older....


Thanks. I'll try to keep an eye out for this next time a dog show comes
through Madison, Wisconsin (or someplace reasonably close).

Scott Jensen
--
Peer-to-peer networking (a.k.a. file-sharing) is entertainment's future.
If you'd like to know why, read the white paper at the link below.
http://www.nonesuch.org/p2prevolution.pdf


  #6  
Old October 20th 03, 08:51 AM
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On Mon, 20 Oct 2003 02:05:43 -0500 Scott T. Jensen whittled these words:
wrote:
But a great obedience dog need not be a great
problem solver. And a great problem solver
might not be able to retain and execute the
various obedience commands.


I was thinking along the lines of a problem-solver. Dogs given problems
that were not revealed to their owners/trainers before the contest to see
how they do.


There have been various competitions that might compete one dog against
another in problem solving. A typical example would be the TV program
"That's my dog" Naturally such contests are individual to the dogs
involved. I've heard it is very entertaining. That show and others
similiar would certainly qualify as contests of problem solving ability
of individual dogs. Not scientific but pertinent to your inquiry.
http://www.ukgameshows.com/atoz/prog.../thats_my_dog/
http://www.superdogs.com/

When people ask about dog intelligence tests some of us tend to cringe
because some folks misunderstand the significance. When Stanely Coren
came out with his list of dogs people started flocking to those at the top
of the list. HIs book "The Intelligence of Dogs" was widely popular and
just as widely misread. From what folks'd write here it was apparent that
they assumed a "smart" dog would be easier. Yikes! and HA! Top problems
solvers are the kind that learn how to open the refrigerator, undo all the
locks in the house, and push the chair to the kichen counter for easy
access to the upper cabinets. NOT easy to live with. Easy to live with
is moderate problem solving, good memory, preference for sticking with
what is known to work and high desire to comply.

Diane Blackman
 




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