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Puppy Temper Tantrums...



 
 
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  #1  
Old November 19th 04, 04:54 AM
Singdrumplay
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Default Puppy Temper Tantrums...

Our 4 month old lab mix throws tantrums on walks. She will take the leash in
her mouth, and when we stop, remove the leash "while saying drop it," she
proceeds to growling, biting, barking, jumping, etc. She will not continue
walking during this fit. She carries on like we're doing something horrible to
her, although we just take the leash from her mouth. She is enrolled in puppy
obedience classes with postitive reinforcement as the training method, and has
responded well to the rest of her training. Do you have any suggestions?
  #2  
Old November 19th 04, 05:21 AM
Emily Carroll/Fluttervale
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"Singdrumplay" wrote in message
...
Our 4 month old lab mix throws tantrums on walks. She will take the leash

in
her mouth, and when we stop, remove the leash "while saying drop it," she
proceeds to growling, biting, barking, jumping, etc. She will not

continue
walking during this fit. She carries on like we're doing something

horrible to
her, although we just take the leash from her mouth. She is enrolled in

puppy
obedience classes with postitive reinforcement as the training method, and

has
responded well to the rest of her training. Do you have any suggestions?


What do you do to try to contain her and encourage her to *not* react like
this? Secondly, what other mental exercise is she receiving? Does she
receive off-lead playtime? It's important that you make sure she gets lots
of off-lead playtime. Playing fetch with her in the yard, running around,
etc.

Secondly, instead of gently removing the leash from her mouth, try giving
her as little leash as you can (don't strangle her or give her *NO* room to
run around--but just give her half an inch to think about) and freeze when
she does this. Don't react to her, don't make her do anything. Get her
nice and bored. You're not doing anything interesting, she's not doing
anything interesting.

Thirdly, work on not letting her have these temper tantrums. I am a big fan
of letting my dogs know that I'm always carrying around treats. They just
never know when they're going to do something that warrants me handing them
out (so they're on their best behavior!) I start out with taking a few
steps, and calling them back to me (I teach them to touch a hand) and get a
treat. Take a few more steps. Instead of being bored, they're constantly
trying to figure out what you're going to ask for next. Eventually they
forget they even GET bored on walks, they are happy in your company.

Puppies go through "stages" and yours is no different Labs are fun, but
you have to make sure they get enough mental stimulation.


--
Emily Carroll
http://www.fluttervale.com/kennel - Fluttervale Labradors
http://www.fluttervale.com/biography - Canine Biography



  #3  
Old November 19th 04, 05:34 AM
culprit
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"Singdrumplay" wrote in message
...
Our 4 month old lab mix throws tantrums on walks. She will take the leash
in
her mouth, and when we stop, remove the leash "while saying drop it," she
proceeds to growling, biting, barking, jumping, etc. She will not
continue
walking during this fit. She carries on like we're doing something
horrible to
her, although we just take the leash from her mouth. She is enrolled in
puppy
obedience classes with postitive reinforcement as the training method, and
has
responded well to the rest of her training. Do you have any suggestions?


it sounds more to me like she's trying to play with you, not having a
tantrum. :-) i'll second Emily's suggestion of freezing, and basically
ignoring the behavior. i'll bet you're reacting somehow, because she's
continuing her behavior for some reason. maybe she thinks you're playing
with her when you take the leash away.

one of my dogs taps on the door to go outside. sometimes he does this over
and over, not even leaving the deck, but turning around to come right back
inside. it's totally annoying. so sometimes when he taps on the door, i'll
give him a good chewy treat, like a bone or a pressed rawhide, in order to
get him to leave me alone for 20 minutes or so.
lately i've noticed that he taps on the door, over and over, very quickly in
succession (telling him "no" doesn't help for long). then he just sits and
looks at me expectantly. that's because i inadvertently taught him that
tapping on the door will get him a really good treat. :-)

everything dogs do, they do for a reason. it's up to us to find that
reason, and remove it if necessary, in order to shape their behavior. make
sense?

-kelly


  #4  
Old November 19th 04, 05:56 AM
Leah
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(Singdrumplay)
wrote:
Our 4 month old lab mix throws tantrums on walks. She will take the leash in
her mouth, and when we stop, remove the leash "while saying drop it," she
proceeds to growling, biting, barking, jumping, etc. She will not continue
walking during this fit. She carries on like we're doing something horrible
to
her, although we just take the leash from her mouth. She is enrolled in
puppy
obedience classes with postitive reinforcement as the training method, and
has
responded well to the rest of her training. Do you have any suggestions?


Have you actually taught her the command "drop it?"

Sounds to me like she thinks it's a fun game. A lot of pups - in particular
the mouthy ones like labs - play tug with their leashes.

The easiest thing to do would be to spray bitter apple, bitter end, or one of
the other yucky-tasting products on the leash so that she no longer wants to
put it in her mouth. You may have to experiment to find one she doesn't mind,
though.

And you could try bringing a toy with you on your walks that she could carry in
her mouth, instead of the leash.

To teach drop it:

1. Let her put something in her mouth (like a toy).

2. Say drop it.

3. Initially, put a treat right up to her nose. Shove it in her nostril if
you have to. Wait patiently until she decides to voluntarily drop the toy to
take the treat. I've yet to see a dog who wouldn't eventually give in to the
smell of the food. :}

4. Praise her, and whip the toy behind your back for a second (to get it out
of her sight, so she doesn't change her mind). Give her the treat.

5. Immediately give her the toy back and leave her alone with it.

After the first few times, you shouldn't have to put the treat to her nose any
more. As quickly as you can (as soon as she understands the command), don't
let her see or smell the treat when you ask her to drop an object. Other than
that, rinse and repeat on the above exercise as many times a day as you can
manage.

I love this method, because you're not only teaching the dog the "drop it"
command, but you're also teaching her that she doesn't have to guard her
treasures from you. A mouthy dog is used to getting stuff taken away from her
and not getting it back. After this training, that dead squirrel she finds
outside will more likely be offered to you, instead of buried in the couch. :}

Whenever she has something in her mouth that you can't give back, like a shoe,
trade it for a toy.

---
Canine Action Dog Trainer
http://www.canineaction.com
It's A Dog's Life
http://hometown.aol.com/dfrntdrums/m...age/index.html
Get Healthy, Build Your Immune System, Lose Weight
http://www.re-vita.net/dfrntdrums

  #5  
Old November 19th 04, 06:26 AM
Paula
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On 19 Nov 2004 03:54:40 GMT, (Singdrumplay)
wrote:

Our 4 month old lab mix throws tantrums on walks. She will take the leash in
her mouth, and when we stop, remove the leash "while saying drop it," she
proceeds to growling, biting, barking, jumping, etc. She will not continue
walking during this fit. She carries on like we're doing something horrible to
her, although we just take the leash from her mouth. She is enrolled in puppy
obedience classes with postitive reinforcement as the training method, and has
responded well to the rest of her training. Do you have any suggestions?


Labs are a really mouthy breed. My lab mix used to also want to take
the leash in her mouth. She also would "hold" my hand with her mouth.
Lately, she has decided that she is too good for chewies but loves to
hunt down and destroy pens. It's up to me to let her know what she
can and cannot have in her mouth. You can get a really short leash, I
think it is called a traffic leash, that gives enough room for her to
walk but not enough for her to reach back and take it in her mouth, at
least not easily. You can also walk her when she is hungry and take
kibble with you. When you stop, feed her some kibble. If she grabs
for the leash, tell her "no" sternly and then as soon as she lets go
of it, praise her profusely. If she doesn't let go on her own, use
kibble to tempt her to let it go so she can fit some food in her
mouth. Even if the only reason she dropped it was greed, praise her
for dropping the leash and make sure you do not do anything that she
enjoys when she has the leash in her mouth.

I have been working on "drop it" with Punk since the pen habit came
up. She also picks up dirty socks, so she apparently has a stinky
feet smell fetish. So I keep her with me in a fairly small room so
she can't sneak anything by me that has some pens and dirty socks
around. When I see her going for something, I tell her "no" and then
praise her when she does something other than grab the forbidden item.
If she gets something anyway, I tell her to "drop it" and praise her
profusely when she drops it. If she refuses to drop it, I walk her
down (another reason for a small enclosed space), tell her "Drop it"
while I open her mouth and take the item out of there, drop it on the
ground while still holding on to her enough that she can't go for it
and praise her for her "good drop it!" If you don't know how to get a
dog to open it's mouth and release something, you might not want to
experiment with one that is out of control, but you can get your vet
to show you how. I first learned it when I needed to get mouths open
to give pills. Now I put pills in yummy food bits to hide them, but
the mouth opening trick still comes in handy for other things.

This afternoon, we were outside playing catch and Punk refused to drop
the ball when I told her to. Instead of joining in a fun game of
keep-away, I told her "No, drop it!" and when she still refused, I
turned my back on her and went inside, leaving her outside. She
dropped that ball really fast then. In that case I decided not to
walk her down for two reasons: Following her around was part of the
game she wanted to play and it wasn't worth it since the yard is
larger than a small room and the ball was something she couldn't harm
herself with and I wouldn't get upset if she chewed up.

So, don't reward the behavior you don't want (don't play her game),
find a way to control whether she can do what you don't want (shorter
leash or same leash wrapped around hand to make it shorter), give her
an alternative (No don't do it in the first place or drop it when she
has it) and praise that alternative. Lure or bribe the behavior you
want if you can't get it from her naturally before that point where
you want to scream in frustration (hungry dog and kibble or treats in
the pocket). Also, be really careful what you let a lab or lab mix
have in her mouth since they are prone to be mouthy anyway.

--
Paula
"I think I'm having the best childhood I've ever had!" ---Mimi
  #6  
Old November 19th 04, 03:08 PM
Scott
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Maybe she is just being a puppy. I would use positive reinforcement to
guide her in her growth, but I would allow her to be a puppy. She is
awfully young.

Singdrumplay wrote:
Our 4 month old lab mix throws tantrums on walks. She will take the leash in
her mouth, and when we stop, remove the leash "while saying drop it," she
proceeds to growling, biting, barking, jumping, etc. She will not continue
walking during this fit. She carries on like we're doing something horrible to
her, although we just take the leash from her mouth. She is enrolled in puppy
obedience classes with postitive reinforcement as the training method, and has
responded well to the rest of her training. Do you have any suggestions?




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  #7  
Old November 19th 04, 05:48 PM
Rocky
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Paula said in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:

I have been working on "drop it" with Punk since the pen
habit came up.


To put a dollar value on it: A "drop it" command would have
saved an acquaintance a $1000 surgery bill on her lab. Said lab
(not a puppy) wouldn't give up a squeaky and, when presented
with a treat in exchange, made the decision to swallow the toy
and then grab and swallow the treat bag.

--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
  #8  
Old November 19th 04, 05:50 PM
Emily Carroll/Fluttervale
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"Rocky" wrote in message
...
Paula said in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:

I have been working on "drop it" with Punk since the pen
habit came up.


To put a dollar value on it: A "drop it" command would have
saved an acquaintance a $1000 surgery bill on her lab. Said lab
(not a puppy) wouldn't give up a squeaky and, when presented
with a treat in exchange, made the decision to swallow the toy
and then grab and swallow the treat bag.

--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.


Forgive me for laughing at the picture of that.

That is SUCH a Lab thing to do.

--
Emily Carroll
http://www.fluttervale.com/kennel - Fluttervale Labradors
http://www.fluttervale.com/biography - Canine Biography



  #9  
Old November 19th 04, 06:27 PM
Melinda Shore
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In article ,
Rocky wrote:
To put a dollar value on it: A "drop it" command would have
saved an acquaintance a $1000 surgery bill on her lab. Said lab
(not a puppy) wouldn't give up a squeaky and, when presented
with a treat in exchange, made the decision to swallow the toy
and then grab and swallow the treat bag.


I'm very sorry for what must have been a terrible scare for
your friend as well the risk to the dog, but it's hard not
to admire a dog with advanced problem-solving skills.
--
Melinda Shore - Software longa, hardware brevis -

"War is heck" -- American Family Association
  #10  
Old November 19th 04, 06:50 PM
Rocky
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Melinda Shore said in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:

To put a dollar value on it: A "drop it" command would
have saved an acquaintance a $1000 surgery bill on her lab.
Said lab (not a puppy) wouldn't give up a squeaky and,
when presented with a treat in exchange, made the decision
to swallow the toy and then grab and swallow the treat
bag.


I'm very sorry for what must have been a terrible scare for
your friend as well the risk to the dog, but it's hard not
to admire a dog with advanced problem-solving skills.


It was a scare for me, too. How's this for problem-solving: The
dog went for the hand that was holding the bag of treats, not
the treat in the proffered hand. In doing so, she scraped up my
hand fairly well (I was attempting the trade after my
acquaintance stood still after saying "drop it drop it drop it"
and after her attempted wrestling away didn't work).

BTW, this was the second time this dog had had bowel surgery and
the Nth time she wouldn't give up a toy to the owner. I told
her to get her dog to the vet ASAP, but she waited until the
next day.

--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
 




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