dunno about the u.s, though probably, but here in New Zealand I went to
a Christmas chidrens party today. Had a great time. Hundreds of people
and kids were there. free food. free drink, shows and games. All
sponsored by local business. Anyway, the spca were there doing there
thing promoting animals etc but at one end of the hall there are the
newfoundland. cart hooked up to the the dog. Dog walked around by the
walker, owner, what ever, pulling this cart with kids in the cart. Now
I gota tell you, many of the dogs looked kinda teed off. bored outa
their flamin skull. Anyway, one dog was lame. And it took me, a non
breeder, house mutt owner to yell out to the person, Hey!. That animals
lame. Due credit to the walker. The dog was taken out straight away.
But what concerns me, is how long that dog had been walking while lame.
And how come I was the only to notice. Also, dogs being dogs, they
will put up with a lot of pain before they let on that they are in pain.
And these are flamin breeders.

and then there is the noise of loud music. You dont need me to tell
you that a dogs hearing range is a lot wider than ours. And I wonder
about the boom boom of loud party/Christmas music. Forty thousand kids
patting and petting them etc. I just wonder if this kinda thing is
being kind to an animal.

cheers. Trog

Troglodyte wrote:

dunno about the u.s, though probably, but here in New Zealand I went to
a Christmas chidrens party today. Had a great time. Hundreds of people
and kids were there. free food. free drink, shows and games. All
sponsored by local business. Anyway, the spca were there doing there
thing promoting animals etc but at one end of the hall there are the
newfoundland. cart hooked up to the the dog. Dog walked around by the
walker, owner, what ever, pulling this cart with kids in the cart. Now
I gota tell you, many of the dogs looked kinda teed off. bored outa
their flamin skull. Anyway, one dog was lame. And it took me, a non
breeder, house mutt owner to yell out to the person, Hey!. That animals
lame. Due credit to the walker. The dog was taken out straight away.
But what concerns me, is how long that dog had been walking while lame.
And how come I was the only to notice. Also, dogs being dogs, they
will put up with a lot of pain before they let on that they are in pain.
And these are flamin breeders.

I'm confused. You say the SPCA was there, and then you
say that the dog people were breeders.

The SPCA where I live, Trog, they sure as hell ain't
breeders. Quite the opposite.

flick 100785


and then there is the noise of loud music. You dont need me to tell
you that a dogs hearing range is a lot wider than ours. And I wonder
about the boom boom of loud party/Christmas music. Forty thousand kids
patting and petting them etc. I just wonder if this kinda thing is
being kind to an animal.

cheers. Trog

flick wrote:

I'm confused. You say the SPCA was there, and then you
say that the dog people were breeders.

The SPCA where I live, Trog, they sure as hell ain't
breeders. Quite the opposite.


I got that at one end of the hall was the SPCA people, and way over at
the other end of the hall were kiddie rides on carts pulled by dogs.

Tara

Tara wrote:
flick wrote:


I'm confused. You say the SPCA was there, and then you
say that the dog people were breeders.

The SPCA where I live, Trog, they sure as hell ain't
breeders. Quite the opposite.



I got that at one end of the hall was the SPCA people, and way over at
the other end of the hall were kiddie rides on carts pulled by dogs.

Oh, thanks. Guess my reading comprehension was worse
than usual when I read Trog's post :-/.

flick 100785

Tara

flick wrote:
Troglodyte wrote:

dunno about the u.s, though probably, but here in New Zealand I went
to a Christmas chidrens party today. Had a great time. Hundreds of
people and kids were there. free food. free drink, shows and games.
All sponsored by local business. Anyway, the spca were there doing
there thing promoting animals etc but at one end of the hall there are
the newfoundland. cart hooked up to the the dog. Dog walked around
by the walker, owner, what ever, pulling this cart with kids in the
cart. Now I gota tell you, many of the dogs looked kinda teed off.
bored outa their flamin skull. Anyway, one dog was lame. And it took
me, a non breeder, house mutt owner to yell out to the person, Hey!.
That animals lame. Due credit to the walker. The dog was taken out
straight away. But what concerns me, is how long that dog had been
walking while lame. And how come I was the only to notice. Also,
dogs being dogs, they will put up with a lot of pain before they let
on that they are in pain. And these are flamin breeders.


I'm confused. You say the SPCA was there, and then you say that the dog
people were breeders.

The SPCA where I live, Trog, they sure as hell ain't breeders. Quite
the opposite.

flick 100785


and then there is the noise of loud music. You dont need me to tell
you that a dogs hearing range is a lot wider than ours. And I wonder
about the boom boom of loud party/Christmas music. Forty thousand
kids patting and petting them etc. I just wonder if this kinda thing
is being kind to an animal.

cheers. Trog



The SPCA people were there promoting the SPCA. You know. Dogs with
little bags on their backs and people put their coins in. Plus leaflets
on animal care.

The newfys were there as well. Some owned by breeders and some owned by
people that just own the dog I guess. Just wondered if was kind to a
dog to put a cart on it, not unlike the trap you might put behind a
horse, and pull kids around. The dogs were walking around in circles
inside with a whole heap of noise and loud music goin on. Just that
when I look at the dogs, they looked kinda, well doing as their owners
bid under sufference. In as much as they had a look on them that
suggested, to me at any rate, that they would really be somewhere else
than doing what they were doing.

May Im just being techy bout it.

cheers

Troglodyte wrote:

The SPCA people were there promoting the SPCA. You know. Dogs with
little bags on their backs and people put their coins in. Plus leaflets
on animal care.

The newfys were there as well. Some owned by breeders and some owned by
people that just own the dog I guess. Just wondered if was kind to a
dog to put a cart on it, not unlike the trap you might put behind a
horse, and pull kids around. The dogs were walking around in circles
inside with a whole heap of noise and loud music goin on. Just that
when I look at the dogs, they looked kinda, well doing as their owners
bid under sufference. In as much as they had a look on them that
suggested, to me at any rate, that they would really be somewhere else
than doing what they were doing.

That's a good question, about dogs and carts. It's
been my impression that many dogs of breeds that were
bred to do work - which is most breeds - *do* enjoy
doing that work. Dogs, in general, like to please
their owners and enjoy exercise. Retrievers like to
retrieve. Terriers like to kill rats. Huskies like to
pull, as anyone who's tried to train one to heel on
leash can tell you ;-). Some of the large breeds, like
Saints and Newfs, have been used to pull carts for
generations, used as small draft animals. A large,
reasonably fit dog should be able to pull 200 lbs
easily, if not more, on a well-designed cart.

I intend to build a small cart for my Saint Bernard, so
he can help me with some of the chores around here and
I don't have to drag or carry things, like rolls of
fence (50-70 lbs).

A well-trained, well-socialized dog in the situation
you describe, pulling a cart with and around lots of
kids, probably took it in stride and wasn't overtly
excited, happy, waggly. True, if the noise level was
extreme, that isn't a good thing for the kids or the dogs.

flick 100785


May Im just being techy bout it.

cheers

Actually Newfoundlands were developed as working dogs. They were used not
only on fishing boats, but as draft animals to deliver milk, mail and other
goods. Newfoundland Clubs encourage owners to maintain the breed's working
instincts by awarding working titles in both water and draft work.

My husband grew up in an outport in Newfoundland and he says that Newfs were
commonly used to pull carts and sleds. His grandfather used to make
harnesses for the dogs, and their dog loved to pull the cart. He could pull
with two kids in the cart or sled with no problem.

Here's a picture of a newf with a cart.
http://www.nzoncanvas.com/wellys_album/ben_cart.jpg

Here's one of Newfoundland around 1900.
http://www.medicalarchives.jhmi.edu/...dogcart100.gif

The newfys were there as well. Some owned by breeders and some owned by
people that just own the dog I guess. Just wondered if was kind to a
dog to put a cart on it, not unlike the trap you might put behind a
horse, and pull kids around.
May Im just being techy bout it.

In article ,
flick wrote:
A large,
reasonably fit dog should be able to pull 200 lbs
easily, if not more, on a well-designed cart.

A rule of thumb used with sleddogs is that a dog can be
expected to pull twice its weight. It's obviously a very
rough rule and one that probably shouldn't be extended to
dogs not built for pulling, but there it is for whatever
it's worth.
--
Melinda Shore - Software longa, hardware brevis -

Amateurs study cryptography; professionals study economics.
-- Allan Schiffman

In article ,
JoKing wrote:
My husband grew up in an outport in Newfoundland and he says that Newfs were
commonly used to pull carts and sleds. His grandfather used to make
harnesses for the dogs, and their dog loved to pull the cart. He could pull
with two kids in the cart or sled with no problem.

Newfs were also taken on some American Arctic expeditions
around the turn of the 20th century. Ships would stop in
Newfoundland en route from New York to pick up dogs.
--
Melinda Shore - Software longa, hardware brevis -

Amateurs study cryptography; professionals study economics.
-- Allan Schiffman

flick wrote in news:wyhvd.194$NQ2.153
@fe25.usenetserver.com:

Retrievers like to
retrieve. Terriers like to kill rats. Huskies like to
pull, as anyone who's tried to train one to heel on
leash can tell you ;-). Some of the large breeds, like
Saints and Newfs, have been used to pull carts for
generations, used as small draft animals. A large,
reasonably fit dog should be able to pull 200 lbs
easily, if not more, on a well-designed cart.


There is a little group of people on Vancouver Island who love drafting.
It got started by a local Berner breeder, but she's spread the word.
Storm's father had a drafting title, and so does the bitch I hope to get a
pup from whenever she (finally) gets (really) preganant. Both dogs love to
pull kids around at hunt tests.

--
Kate
and Storm the FCR