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Dogs and anticipation?
On Fri, 01 Jul 2005 04:49:10 GMT, Goo wrote:
No dog has any sense of anticipation longer than a couple of seconds. Can you back up that absurd sounding claim? |
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Wow are you wrong, My dog Barney would ride all over the place with us and
never carried on and became excited except every time we went through Phillipsburg. He knew the second we were there that it meant we were going to camp. He would be wound up from there until 40 minutes later when we finally arrived. Celeste wrote in message ... On Fri, 01 Jul 2005 04:49:10 GMT, Goo wrote: No dog has any sense of anticipation longer than a couple of seconds. Can you back up that absurd sounding claim? |
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On Sat, 02 Jul 2005 07:53:22 -0400, Jim Elbrecht wrote:
On Fri, 01 Jul 2005 14:31:38 -0400, wrote: On Fri, 01 Jul 2005 04:49:10 GMT, Goo wrote: No dog has any sense of anticipation longer than a couple of seconds. Can you back up that absurd sounding claim? If Goo comes back with a theory-- I'll dispute it with personal experience. Goo is short for Goobernicus. It would be hilarious to see him try to defend his beliefs, but he is most likely as afraid to try as he is with a number of similar absurd sounding ideas that he wants to promote. He also insists that animals are incapable of feeling pride, and also disappointment. It's a level of ignorance that is quite impressive. LOL...Darwin gives an excellent example of his dog experiencing disappointment, and describes the dog's expression of it and his change of behaviour as a result of it. Goo quite amusingly insists that Darwin's observation is merely his own projection of an emotion Goo believes--now get this--is too complex for animals to be able to experience. Hilarious! I used to keep my small-game hunting jacket in an upstairs closet. When I was hunting that day I would take it out of the closet and carry it downstairs. My rabbit dog would go nuts until we left the house together, me wearing the jacket. It didn't matter if it was 10 minutes for a quick cup of coffee or several hours for an afternoon hunt. If I went outside without the jacket she'd remain inside 'guarding' it. Now she was an exceptional dog- a mutt from a mostly beagle and mostly black & tan- so I don't doubt that there are some dogs [just like some people] that can't anticipate any more than a couple seconds. But the *No dogs* claim is definitely wrong. Jim I feel quite certain that he would not only insist no dogs are able to, but that no animals at all are capable of it, if he is able to muster up the courage to defend his absurd beliefs. He is very much the coward about things like this, but maybe he'll share some of his vast and amusing "knowledge" and "experience". Goo? |
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****wit David Harrison wrote:
On Fri, 01 Jul 2005 04:49:10 GMT, Goo wrote: No dog has any sense of anticipation longer than a couple of seconds. Can you back up that absurd sounding claim? Shut up, ****wit. |
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dh@. wrote:
On Sat, 02 Jul 2005 07:53:22 -0400, Jim Elbrecht wrote: On Fri, 01 Jul 2005 14:31:38 -0400, wrote: On Fri, 01 Jul 2005 04:49:10 GMT, Goo wrote: No dog has any sense of anticipation longer than a couple of seconds. Can you back up that absurd sounding claim? If Goo comes back with a theory-- I'll dispute it with personal experience. Goo is Baby talk. Stop using it, ****wit. You are forty-****ing-six years old. Stop using baby talk. |
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On Sat, 02 Jul 2005 14:49:08 -0400, dh@. wrote:
On Sat, 02 Jul 2005 07:53:22 -0400, Jim Elbrecht wrote: On Fri, 01 Jul 2005 14:31:38 -0400, wrote: On Fri, 01 Jul 2005 04:49:10 GMT, Goo wrote: No dog has any sense of anticipation longer than a couple of seconds. Can you back up that absurd sounding claim? If Goo comes back with a theory-- I'll dispute it with personal experience. Goo is short for Goobernicus. You're so funny. You kill me every time. It would be hilarious to see him try to defend his beliefs, but he is most likely as afraid to try as he is with a number of similar absurd sounding ideas that he wants to promote. He also insists that animals are incapable of feeling pride, Then I take it you would have no objection to the proposition that animals are capable of rational thinking that in itself can recognise its own value by inference alone. Well done, Dave, although for the record I totally disagree with any such proposition. pride n. A sense of one's own proper dignity or value; self-respect. http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=pride Now you've acknowledge animals own dignity and value, even to the point where they can recognise it within themselves introspectively, what justification do you have for taking this dignity and value away from them by having them farmed and slaughtered, simply for your taste preferences? Does the concept of dignity and inherent value mean that little to you? and also disappointment. Disappointment can only arise if one's expectations are dashed, which necessarily means a knowledge of the future and an understanding of one's abilities. Do animals have these capabilities? It's a level of ignorance that is quite impressive. LOL...Darwin gives an excellent example of his dog experiencing disappointment, and describes the dog's expression of it and his change of behaviour as a result of it. Darwin affirms the consequent when concluding his dog can feel disappointment, simply by looking into its face or observing its behaviour. 1) If the dog is disappointed, then he will do x, y, z. 2) He does x, y, z therefore 3) the dog is disappointed. Goo quite amusingly insists that Darwin's observation is merely his own projection of an emotion He's right. |
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Rudy Canoza wrote:
The jacket was a signal. Animals respond to signals. Dr. Pavlov demonstrated that over 100 years ago. That isn't the same thing as anticipation. If you tell your dog today you're going to go rabbit hunting tomorrow, the dog will stare at you stupidly. Demonstrate how programmed behaviour in response to stimuli in dogs (bell = food) is any different to anticipation in humans "Let's go to McDonalds" causes salivation and other observable behaviour... ....Brock. |
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On Sat, 02 Jul 2005 14:49:08 -0400, dh@. wrote:
I feel quite certain that he would not only insist no dogs are able to, but that no animals at all are capable of it You're on record as claiming animals cannot anticipate things, even their own deaths, even if those animals are witnessing the deaths of others in their immediate vicinity; "You might feel that they become afraid when they see the pigs before them get killed, but that's not the case either. I've seen pigs killed in front of each other several times, and talked to other people who have as well, and never have seen or heard of an instance where a pig became scared of its own slaughter after witnessing that of another. In fact just the opposite...what I've seen is them sniffing the dead pig, and drinking its blood." David Harrison May 3 2004 http://tinyurl.com/bzppt But, seeing as you've now changed your mind and accept the notion that animals can anticipate things, why aren't you doing as earlier promised and thinking "about the whole thing [killing animals for food] in a different way"? "My position is that they don't understand their position. They don't know about death, they don't know about meat, and they certainly don't know they will be killed so humans can eat them. If they did, I would think about the whole thing in a different way" David Harrison Mar 12 2001 http://tinyurl.com/bl2xa "If the animals we raise for food knew the situation they are in, it would change my way of thinking about it a great deal." David Harrison Sep 20 2003 http://tinyurl.com/b4lcs According to you, animals can anticipate things, which necessarily means they are aware of their immediate situation. Have you started thinking about your diet on them differently, or were you lying again? |
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