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A lesson and a poll



 
 
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  #1  
Old December 2nd 05, 03:59 AM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior
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Default A lesson and a poll

There is no fence between our neighbors' house and ours (yet). We have
an informal system with them. We've each agreed to not let our dogs out
for a pee if the others' dog(s) are already out.

Monday night our system failed. I failed to see through some tree
branches and didn't notice that their two dogs (one dog-aggressive, one
not--at least not toward Orson) were already out.

Orson paid with bite wounds, 3 vet visits, surgery, a drain in his leg,
a scary swollen frankenfoot, a nasty limp, aggravated arthritis, and 10
days of no exercise.

We paid with our wallets: $1400 so far. Also, with guilt. My guilt is
somewhat assuaged knowing I was able to hold the 100lb dog to keep it
from potentially becoming a 2-on-1.

My lesson, for anyone who needs one, is no matter how many times
something has worked in the past, don't assume it always will. Also
don't assume just because the 10yo, 40lb dog is an absolute darling
with people that she won't try to kill your 80lb dog. (I did not assume
this, but it occurs to me someone might.)

The poll
How much, if any, would you ask the neighbor to pay toward the vet
bills, if the following were true:
- Your dog was attacked on your property.
- The attack was sustained (shaking, re-gripping), not just a
bite-and-run.
- The attacking dog had attacked other dogs before.
- Both you and the neighbor were negligent as far as making sure no one
was already outside.

Cate
p.s. Just since I haven't been here in a while: Orson also had colon
polyp surgery in August. It's been a rough few months for him.

  #2  
Old December 2nd 05, 04:11 AM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior
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Default A lesson and a poll

On Thu, 01 Dec 2005 18:59:47 -0800, Cate wrote:


The poll
How much, if any, would you ask the neighbor to pay toward the vet
bills, if the following were true:
- Your dog was attacked on your property.
- The attack was sustained (shaking, re-gripping), not just a
bite-and-run.
- The attacking dog had attacked other dogs before.
- Both you and the neighbor were negligent as far as making sure no one
was already outside.


If you took it to court, the judge would almost certainly find that the
neighbor was 100% responsible.

To allow a known aggressive dog loose, off-leash, in an unfenced yard,
is criminal. That dog should either be put down, or kept secured -
leashed and muzzled - for the rest of its life.

--
Freedom is not empowerment. Empowerment is what the Serbs have in
Bosnia. Anybody can grab a gun and be empowered. It's not entitlement. An
entitlement is what people on welfare get, and how free are they? It's
not an endlessly expanding list of rights - the 'right' to education,
the 'right' to health care, the 'right' to food and housing. That's not
freedom, that's dependency. Those aren't rights, those are the rations
of slavery - hay and a barn for human cattle.
-- P.J. O'Rourke

  #3  
Old December 2nd 05, 04:16 AM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior
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Default A lesson and a poll

On 1 Dec 2005 18:59:47 -0800, "Cate" wrote:

There is no fence between our neighbors' house and ours (yet). We have
an informal system with them. We've each agreed to not let our dogs out
for a pee if the others' dog(s) are already out.

Monday night our system failed. I failed to see through some tree
branches and didn't notice that their two dogs (one dog-aggressive, one
not--at least not toward Orson) were already out.

Orson paid with bite wounds, 3 vet visits, surgery, a drain in his leg,
a scary swollen frankenfoot, a nasty limp, aggravated arthritis, and 10
days of no exercise.

We paid with our wallets: $1400 so far. Also, with guilt. My guilt is
somewhat assuaged knowing I was able to hold the 100lb dog to keep it
from potentially becoming a 2-on-1.

My lesson, for anyone who needs one, is no matter how many times
something has worked in the past, don't assume it always will. Also
don't assume just because the 10yo, 40lb dog is an absolute darling
with people that she won't try to kill your 80lb dog. (I did not assume
this, but it occurs to me someone might.)

The poll
How much, if any, would you ask the neighbor to pay toward the vet
bills, if the following were true:
- Your dog was attacked on your property.
- The attack was sustained (shaking, re-gripping), not just a
bite-and-run.
- The attacking dog had attacked other dogs before.
- Both you and the neighbor were negligent as far as making sure no one
was already outside.


Half. If I were the neighbor, I would offer more.

So sorry this happened. Poor Orson; it sounds as though he could use
a run of good health - - I hope he gets it.

Mustang Sally

  #4  
Old December 2nd 05, 04:27 AM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior
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Default A lesson and a poll

In article ,
sighthounds & siberians wrote:
Half. If I were the neighbor, I would offer more.


If I were the neighbor I think I'd offer to pay for the
whole thing. I might be inclined to ask for it depending on
circumstances (mostly on the neighbor's attitude and
willingness to correct the problem, somewhat on their
financial circumstances).

It seems to me that there are (at least) two issues he 1)
covering expenses, and 2) making sure that nothing like this
happens again. The apparently clueless neighbor needs some
disincentives for letting their marauding dog continue to
maraud. In a city or suburban setting those are probably
going to be economic (if they won't pay voluntarily, either
small claims court or a fine from the friendly local animal
control officers and their friendly local ticket books).
Out here in the boonies a dog that attacked people, pets, or
livestock off its own property would eventually get the 3-S
treatment (shoot, shovel, and shut up) from people who've
had enough.
--
Melinda Shore - Software longa, hardware brevis -

Make it a Sony-free holiday.
  #5  
Old December 2nd 05, 04:39 AM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior
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Default A lesson and a poll


"Cate" wrote:


Orson paid with bite wounds, 3 vet visits, surgery, a drain in his leg,
a scary swollen frankenfoot, a nasty limp, aggravated arthritis, and 10
days of no exercise.


Ouch. Poor Orson! I hope he's feeling better.

The poll
How much, if any, would you ask the neighbor to pay toward the vet
bills, if the following were true:
- Your dog was attacked on your property.
- The attack was sustained (shaking, re-gripping), not just a
bite-and-run.
- The attacking dog had attacked other dogs before.
- Both you and the neighbor were negligent as far as making sure no one
was already outside.


Since they are the ones who failed to control their KNOWN dangerously
aggressive dog, IMO the burden of fault lies with them. You should NOT be
having to look around for their dog every time you take your dog out on your
own property!!!

As far as what they should pay, IMO they should foot the entire bill. I
believe they are legally entirely responsible, since the attack ocurred on
your property, and they *knew* their dog was aggressive.

I'd think also be asking/requiring them to either foot the entire cost
ofthe cost of installing secure fencing between the yards, or having the dog
leashed at all times. If they did not agree, I'd be taking them to court.
Furthermore, I *would* be reporting the incident to A.C. and/or the police,
since the dog is a repeat offender.




  #6  
Old December 2nd 05, 05:31 AM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior
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Default A lesson and a poll

"Cate" said in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:

Monday night our system failed.


I'm really and truly sorry for all of the dogs' injuries, but
were you out there with them?

--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
  #7  
Old December 2nd 05, 06:46 AM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior
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Default A lesson and a poll


"Cate" wrote in message
ups.com...
There is no fence between our neighbors' house and ours (yet). We have
an informal system with them. We've each agreed to not let our dogs out
for a pee if the others' dog(s) are already out.

Monday night our system failed. I failed to see through some tree
branches and didn't notice that their two dogs (one dog-aggressive, one
not--at least not toward Orson) were already out.


The poll
How much, if any, would you ask the neighbor to pay toward the vet
bills, if the following were true:
- Your dog was attacked on your property.
- The attack was sustained (shaking, re-gripping), not just a
bite-and-run.
- The attacking dog had attacked other dogs before.
- Both you and the neighbor were negligent as far as making sure no one
was already outside.


i would think your neighbors would offer to pay at least half, out of
kindness or guilt. i know i would. however, if their dogs were already
out, and you let yours out second, you technically are responsible for the
break in the "system".

it doesn't matter who's property it happened on, since you've basically
agreed to share property until you get a fence installed.

that's what dog aggressive breeds do (i'm guessing pit?). if i shared a
yard with another dog aggressive breed, my dogs would be out on leash,
especially at night. it's just safer for everyone.

so you're both negligent, and you're both responsible for the incident. you
knew the other dog was aggressive, and you agreed to share the yard. i
don't think you should or can take any sort of legal action here, and i
don't think you can hold it against your neighbor with a clear conscience.

if i were the neighbor, however, besides chipping in for vet bills, i'd
probably bring you flowers, a get well card, and the biggest chew toy i
could find.

-kelly




  #8  
Old December 2nd 05, 12:00 PM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior
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Default A lesson and a poll

Monday night our system failed.

I'm really and truly sorry for all of the dogs' injuries, but
were you out there with them?
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.




She says this in the original post: "My guilt is somewhat assuaged knowing
I was able to hold the 100lb dog to keep it
from potentially becoming a 2-on-1." That sounds like she was out there.
--Katrina


  #9  
Old December 2nd 05, 12:14 PM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior
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Posts: n/a
Default A lesson and a poll


"Cate" wrote in message
ups.com...


The poll
How much, if any, would you ask the neighbor to pay toward the vet
bills, if the following were true:
- Your dog was attacked on your property.
- The attack was sustained (shaking, re-gripping), not just a
bite-and-run.
- The attacking dog had attacked other dogs before.
- Both you and the neighbor were negligent as far as making sure no one
was already outside.

Cate
p.s. Just since I haven't been here in a while: Orson also had colon
polyp surgery in August. It's been a rough few months for him.


Poor Orson! I hope he feels better soon!

For what it's worth, I suspect that a court would decide in your favor since
this dog is known to be aggressive and the attack happened on your property.
If I was your neighbor with the aggressive dog I would pay 100% with many
apologies, flowers to you and a big chewie for Orson, AND put in measures to
prevent this from ever happening again (get a fence or put the dog on a
trolley or on leash every time the dog is outside). However you are the one
who has to live next to this neighbor and I know that feuds have started
over stuff like this even though one party was clearly at fault. So you
gotta use diplomacy in this situation - I don't mean that you should be a
wimp but suing for damages would be bad start. Anyway, IMHO, more important
than the vet bills (big ouch!) is to get a good secure fence up right away.

Chris and her smoothies
Pablo & Lucy


  #10  
Old December 2nd 05, 12:23 PM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior
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Default A lesson and a poll

on 2005-12-01 at 18:59 wrote:

The poll
How much, if any, would you ask the neighbor to pay toward the vet
bills, if the following were true:
- Your dog was attacked on your property.
- The attack was sustained (shaking, re-gripping), not just a
bite-and-run.
- The attacking dog had attacked other dogs before.
- Both you and the neighbor were negligent as far as making sure no one
was already outside.


100%. and, i'd ask them to split the cost of a fence between
the two yards ASAP.

p.s. Just since I haven't been here in a while: Orson also
had colon polyp surgery in August. It's been a rough few
months for him.


aw, poor guy!

--
shelly
http://www.cat-sidh.net
http://cat-sidh.blogspot.com/
 




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