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Touble House/Crate Training



 
 
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  #1  
Old February 2nd 06, 02:39 PM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior
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Default Touble House/Crate Training

I adopted a 9 month old puppy who was rescued from a puppy mill. She
obviously had no training of any kind. I have had her three weeks now
and the crate training is not going well. I am not working right now,
so I am home with her all day. I take her out all the time, and give
her treats when she goes, everything I read about doing. And all of
that is going well, she does not have accidents in the house, and she
makes it 7 hours overnight in the crate just fine. The problems come
when I leave her. I have never left her more than 3 hours alone, and
always make sure she goes before I leave, but every time I come home
there is pee and poop all over the crate. I don't know if this is a
house breaking problem or anxiety over my leaving her alone, I have no
idea. Can anyone help?

  #2  
Old February 2nd 06, 04:03 PM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior
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Default Touble House/Crate Training

First, how big is the crate compared to her? Does she have enough room
to do her illicit business on one side and then lie down on the other?
If the crate is too big, the puppy may consider the "other end" of the
crate a good spot to go. (This is a long shot since she goes the night
without making a mess, but I figured I'd mention it.)

Will she willingly go into the crate during the day while you are home,
or only at night? Moreover, will she go into the crate willingly at
all? Is their something particular about the crate at night that she
knows you are still home, such as its location?

  #3  
Old February 2nd 06, 05:17 PM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior
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Default Touble House/Crate Training

Jessica,

In case you didn't know, Puppy Wiz is a whack job and is to be ignored.


If nothing else, the fact that he felt compelled to cross-post his
reply to all of rec.pets.dogs.* is a good sign that he is only here to
entertain himself.

  #4  
Old February 2nd 06, 08:04 PM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior
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Default Touble House/Crate Training

"Jessica" said in
rec.pets.dogs.behavior:

I don't know if this is a
house breaking problem or anxiety over my leaving her
alone, I have no idea.


I think that this is a "I haven't figured out what you want"
problem. As a puppy from a puppy mill, she learned to go inside
her enclosure and now she's not supposed to.

You may have to spend a lot of time outside with her and wait to
reward her when she goes. If she won't go on grass, try her on
gravel or dirt or pavement or even chain link lying on the
ground - IOW, work with her towards what you want and away from
what she's been brought up to believe is acceptable.

As to the inside crate - it may be too large. During her
retraining, though, I'd use the crate way less and supervise
more. Continue to use the crate for good stuff, like meals, and
only sparingly otherwise, like when you're in the shower. Don't
set her up for failure - leave her in the crate for only a few
minutes at a time so she doesn't have a chance to go. First,
though, give it a good cleaning.

--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
  #5  
Old February 2nd 06, 10:24 PM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior
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Default Touble House/Crate Training

Thank you for all of your help everyone!

To answer your questions back, her crate is just big enough for her to
turn around in. I started with a bigger one, but downsized after the
first accident thinking she was just going and then getting away from
it. She still goes in the smaller crate.

I have been taking her outside LOTS and giving her praise and treats
whenever she goes there. She almost seems indiscriminate- she will go
outside, inside, anywhere!

She doesn't necessarily love going in the crate, but if I put her in
there while I am home she doesn't have any accidents. I am certain she
can hear from the crate whether or not I am home.

I also have another dog (four years old), who does not go in a crate
ever. They get along great, and it doesn't bother her when we are all
home and she is the only one in the crate.

I had not considered not using the crate, I might give this a test run
and leave her in just a small room for a short time.

Thanks again for your help everyone. I think I will try to go
crate-free for a while.

  #6  
Old February 3rd 06, 06:37 AM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior
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Default Touble House/Crate Training

On Thu, 02 Feb 2006 10:16:27 -0500, Handsome Jack Morrison
wrote:

I'd stop using the crate. According to your post, this pup may have
been used to "going" inside his crate at the puppy mill for close to 9
months already(!). That means your pup has probably been *classically
conditioned* to always "going" in his crate (if it's a typical puppy
mill, your pup may have never set foot on green grass until you
rescued him), just like pups can be classically conditioning to
"going" outside over time (by only being allowed to "go" outside).


I wonder if you could get a puppy mill pup to pee and poop on a pee
pad inside the crate and therefore allow it out and about in the room.
I wouldn't give it a whole lot of room, but it would be interesting to
see if it would choose the crate to potty and play and sleep
elsewhere.

As far as advice to the OP: Since you are home, don't crate the pup,
tether it to you with a leash and watch it like a hawk for any signs
it is going or looking for a spot to go. Scoop it up and take it to
where you want it to go at any sign. It's a pain, but well worth it,
to keep an eagle eye out at all times until the dog gets the idea.

--
Paula
Persons with names like Sierra, Sequoia, Auburn, and Rainbow
can't sing the Blues no matter how many men they shoot in Memphis.
  #7  
Old February 3rd 06, 07:25 PM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior
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Default Touble House/Crate Training

Handsome Jack Morrison
wrote in news
My best (and quickest) success with pups (and dogs) who have already
been spoiled to the crate has come by ditching them altogether (the
crate, not the pup!).

This particular pup has probably (we may never know for sure) been
classically conditioned for up to 9 months to going inside his crate.
That's pretty hard to overcome. At this point, just the presence of
the crate might trigger the pup's urge to "go" ("conditioned
stimulus").


Would changing the type of crate have any effect?? If the pup (while at the
mill) was kept in a wire crate, would changing crates to a solid plastic
travel crate make a difference?

--
Marcel and Moogli
http://mudbunny.blogspot.com/
 




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