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  #1  
Old November 27th 06, 08:00 PM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior,rec.pets.dogs.health
jabadoodle
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Posts: 15
Default Three Questions

Quesions below, but first some background:

So about a month ago I got a dog, Jeebus, from an aquaintance that could no
longer keep him. The previous owner tells me he is a mixed breed (pointer,
lab, and pit) and is 3 years old. Jeebus is a very happy dog, never shows
any agression toward humans, is kindly tolerent of kids, and is generally
working out well. He seems pretty smart in picking up on things. Like if he
is sniffing around the table while we eat and I tell him to go lay down, he
does. ~ We live on about 2 acres of land most of which is lawn. There are
woods nearby but also some moderatly heavily traveled roads.

There are three humans in the house and my Dad is retired. So Jeebus' daily
routine is pretty much: He sleeps inside, either in the living room or in my
room -- his choice. I get up and have coffee, talk, etc. paying some
attention to the dog. I take him for a good long walk where he does his
business and gets to smell all the animals (deer, rabits, other dogs, etc)
that are around. I feed him before I go to work. ~ My dad is usually around
and Jeebus is sometimes inside, sometimes tied out. In the afternoon my dad
takes him for a walk and/or to the dog-park where he plays and wrestles with
other dogs. ~ By the time I get home from work Jeebus has been fed again and
is in for the night.

He's been to the vet. Got a check-up and all is well. He's on heat-worm
preventative and also FrontLine for ticks. (Lots of ticks around and he
often has them on him after a walk). Fortunately the ticks are easy to spot
on his short white hair.

He has on occasion gotten agressive with other dogs. But mostly 95% of the
time/dogs he plays very well with them.

We are all getting along very well. I didn't want to put a lot of pressure
on anyone at first -- thinking it would be better to just relax with the
situation for a while. ~ Oh, and last week he was neutered, which has not
so far seemed to effect his behavior in any way.


QUESTION -- HE RUNS OFF IF NOT ON THE LEASH:
My biggest problem with him is that when he is off the leash he runs off.
It's not every time or all the time. If I'm playing keep-away with him (his
favorite game) he'll keep playing with me. And it's not like he bolts the
moment I take him off the leash. But if 60 seconds goes by that I'm not
paying attention to him, well, it's like he realizes, "Hey, I'm free and I
remember all those amimal smells from my walk so I'm going to go check them
out." Then he runs into the woods or over into the brush. And no amount of
calling to him will get him to pay attention in the least. (But I know he
can hear me fine because when he's on the long leash he'll turn around when
I call his name.). ~ And I wouldn't mind him roaming around the woods or the
brush, except there are some roads not too far away. I don't want him to be
chasing some squirel accross the road and get hit. And also if he got the
secnt (or saw) one of the many deer around I'm afraid he could just keep
chasing it way into the woods and not come back.

So, what can I do about it? The best theory I have so far is to bring
treats on our walks and to every-so-often call him and give him a treat when
he comes. Hoping that he'll learn to come when I call.

Is this good? Is there anything else I can do?


QUESTION -- FOOD NEUTRITION:
I believe the previous owner was feeding him mostly dry food (kibble?). I
have been doing the same and my mom often has a little "extra" that we give
him. We don't feed from the table or the kitchen. I put it in his dish,
either with the dry-food or by itself. The "extra" is some of whatever meat
we are having. ~ When I asked him the vet said dry-food was fine.

Today I went to a "fancy" local pet store. This guy sells "raw diet" food.
It's basically frozen tubes of chopped up meat. Guy there said this is
closer to what dogs eat naturally and that a diet of this would help him be
healther, have a better coat, be more resistent to ticks, etc. etc.

I don't mind spending the money on this IF IT WOULD REALLY BE BETTER FOR THE
DOG. But I have no need to spend that money just to make me feel good.

So is dry OK? Is giving some of our extra "human" food? Maybe part of this
"raw" diet and part dry food?



QUESTION -- SHEDDING, ODOR, BATHS:

So this part is pretty minor: He sheds quite a bit. It's not bad because his
hair is short. But still, to keep the house clean I have to vacuum a little
each day. I don't mind, and if that's just how it is, then so be it. But I
see suppliments & oils that supposedly keep the coat healthier and reduce
shedding and reduce scratching.

So these work? Or maybe it's related back to the last question (diet)?

What about ODOR & baths. I've given him a coupld baths. When I first got him
his hair was pretty "greassy" and each time I pet him my hands felt oily.
Now after a few baths he feels smooth & clean. But maybe too much bathing is
not good?



THANKS for any help and suggestions,
Gary



  #2  
Old November 27th 06, 08:11 PM posted to rec.pets.dogs.health
Janet B
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Posts: 1,260
Default Three Questions

On Mon, 27 Nov 2006 15:00:57 -0500, "jabadoodle"
, clicked their heels and said:


So, what can I do about it? The best theory I have so far is to bring
treats on our walks and to every-so-often call him and give him a treat when
he comes. Hoping that he'll learn to come when I call.

Is this good? Is there anything else I can do?


Train him. Keep him on leash until he is reliably trained. It's that
simple.

I don't mind spending the money on this IF IT WOULD REALLY BE BETTER FOR THE
DOG. But I have no need to spend that money just to make me feel good.

So is dry OK? Is giving some of our extra "human" food? Maybe part of this
"raw" diet and part dry food?


Proper raw diets and quality dry foods are both good. I feed my dogs
both or either - my dogs have different needs and some do better on
one type of food than another. I'm pretty keen on "if it ain't broke,
don't fix it". In other words, if he does well on the dry food (and
human food, as long as it's not junk scraps, is fine to add), it's
convenient and a very reasonable way to feed a dog.

So this part is pretty minor: He sheds quite a bit. It's not bad because his
hair is short. But still, to keep the house clean I have to vacuum a little
each day. I don't mind, and if that's just how it is, then so be it. But I
see suppliments & oils that supposedly keep the coat healthier and reduce
shedding and reduce scratching.


Basically, dogs shed, and his combo is likely to be a heavy shedder of
those teeny, short hairs.

So these work? Or maybe it's related back to the last question (diet)?


Diet does play a role, but usually, unless a diet is very poor, not
much will change shedding. It's a natural part of being a dog.

What about ODOR & baths. I've given him a coupld baths. When I first got him
his hair was pretty "greassy" and each time I pet him my hands felt oily.
Now after a few baths he feels smooth & clean. But maybe too much bathing is
not good?


You don't want to dry his skin and coat. If he been neglected or
living outdoors, initial baths were appropriate. Labs have water
repellant coat, but that can be clean as well. I rarely bathe my
dogs, but would limit it to an "as needed" basis.

--
Janet Boss
www.bestfriendsdogobedience.com
  #3  
Old November 27th 06, 08:12 PM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior,rec.pets.dogs.health
jabadoodle
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Posts: 15
Default Three Questions


Ok, so that was 3 main questions with lots of little ones.

To add another, anyone know specifically about the product Halo Dream Coat?


  #4  
Old November 27th 06, 11:43 PM posted to rec.pets.dogs.health
Spot
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Posts: 323
Default Odor

Like Janet said dogs rarely need baths.

My two get bathed about three times a year and in between if either gets
stinky I simply soak a wash clothe in white vinegar and wipe their coats
down with it really good. You don't soak the dog with vinegar just rub the
fur back and forth in both directions. The vinegar neutralizes the odors
pretty quickly

Celeste


  #5  
Old November 28th 06, 12:02 AM posted to rec.pets.dogs.behavior,rec.pets.dogs.health
Sandy in OK
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Posts: 788
Default Three Questions


jabadoodle wrote:
He has on occasion gotten agressive with other dogs. But mostly 95% of the
time/dogs he plays very well with them.


Describe aggressive? What does he do? What does the other dog do?
Honestly, I wouldn't be taking a dog who had ANY real aggression issues
to a dog park. Certainly not until you have had him longer, have a more
solid relationship and a really solid recall


QUESTION -- HE RUNS OFF IF NOT ON THE LEASH:
My biggest problem with him is that when he is off the leash he runs off.
It's not every time or all the time. If I'm playing keep-away with him (his
favorite game) he'll keep playing with me. And it's not like he bolts the
moment I take him off the leash. But if 60 seconds goes by that I'm not
paying attention to him, well, it's like he realizes, "Hey, I'm free and I
remember all those amimal smells from my walk so I'm going to go check them
out." Then he runs into the woods or over into the brush. And no amount of
calling to him will get him to pay attention in the least. (But I know he
can hear me fine because when he's on the long leash he'll turn around when
I call his name.). ~ And I wouldn't mind him roaming around the woods or the
brush, except there are some roads not too far away. I don't want him to be
chasing some squirel accross the road and get hit. And also if he got the
secnt (or saw) one of the many deer around I'm afraid he could just keep
chasing it way into the woods and not come back.

So, what can I do about it? The best theory I have so far is to bring
treats on our walks and to every-so-often call him and give him a treat when
he comes. Hoping that he'll learn to come when I call.

Is this good? Is there anything else I can do?


How hard have you worked on having a really solid recall? It needs to
be started in a low distraction environment. And gradually build. And
until he had that, he's be talking the walks in the woods on a long
line. Chances are, at this point you simply can't compete for your
dog's attention with a deer or a squirrel. So don't put him in
positions where he gets a chance to choose. I'm sure you'd like for him
to have more freedom than that, but until you've built a solid
foundation, you'll just be teaching him that "come" has no meaning, and
that choosing to ignore you is very rewarding. Two rules for a recall -
never call the dog to you for something unpleasant and never call the
dog when you can't guarantee that he'll come. If you've ruined your cue
word, pick another and start again.


QUESTION -- FOOD NEUTRITION:
I believe the previous owner was feeding him mostly dry food (kibble?). I
have been doing the same and my mom often has a little "extra" that we give
him. We don't feed from the table or the kitchen. I put it in his dish,
either with the dry-food or by itself. The "extra" is some of whatever meat
we are having. ~ When I asked him the vet said dry-food was fine.

Today I went to a "fancy" local pet store. This guy sells "raw diet" food.
It's basically frozen tubes of chopped up meat. Guy there said this is
closer to what dogs eat naturally and that a diet of this would help him be
healther, have a better coat, be more resistent to ticks, etc. etc.

I don't mind spending the money on this IF IT WOULD REALLY BE BETTER FOR THE
DOG. But I have no need to spend that money just to make me feel good.

So is dry OK? Is giving some of our extra "human" food? Maybe part of this
"raw" diet and part dry food?


I use a really good quality kibble without corn, wheat or soy (and a
lot of preservatives) The thing is, dogs are natural scavengers. If you
wanted to really feed them a natural, species appropriate diet, you'd
have to be feeding scat and garbage.



QUESTION -- SHEDDING, ODOR, BATHS:

So this part is pretty minor: He sheds quite a bit. It's not bad because his
hair is short. But still, to keep the house clean I have to vacuum a little
each day. I don't mind, and if that's just how it is, then so be it. But I
see suppliments & oils that supposedly keep the coat healthier and reduce
shedding and reduce scratching.

So these work? Or maybe it's related back to the last question (diet)?

What about ODOR & baths. I've given him a coupld baths. When I first got him
his hair was pretty "greassy" and each time I pet him my hands felt oily.
Now after a few baths he feels smooth & clean. But maybe too much bathing is
not good?

The greasy and stinky could be because he was dirty, or because of a
very poor quality food (Ol Roy or something). If it comes back on the
better food and he is itchy, you might talk to your vet about the fact
he might have a systemic yeast infection or allergies. I had one little
rescue come in who would start stinking about half an hour after a bath
and it made your hands itch just to pet her. Holistic vet DXed yeast
and put her on olive leaf extract. It was amazing how quickly she
cleared up. But you should first of all get the opinion of your vet if
this continues to be an issue. BroomSandy

  #6  
Old November 28th 06, 12:04 AM posted to rec.pets.dogs.health
Shelly
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Posts: 3,103
Default Odor

"Spot" wrote in
news:[email protected]:

Like Janet said dogs rarely need baths.


That's highly dog dependent. I've had dogs that never needed
baths, and others that required monthly bathing. Show dogs are
sometimes bathed on a daily basis, with no harm to their skin or
coat, as long as appropriate products are used.

My two get bathed about three times a year


If I bathed my dog three times a year, my house would stink to high
heavens. And, while vinegar might be an acceptable substitute on
occasion, I wouldn't want to put something that acidic on my dog as
frequently as she would require it.

--
Shelly
http://www.cat-sidh.net (the Mother Ship)
http://esther.cat-sidh.net (Letters to Esther)

Never put granny in a bag.
-- Eddie Izzard
  #7  
Old November 28th 06, 12:13 AM posted to rec.pets.dogs.health
Janet B
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Posts: 1,260
Default Odor

On 28 Nov 2006 00:04:00 GMT, Shelly , clicked
their heels and said:

That's highly dog dependent. I've had dogs that never needed
baths, and others that required monthly bathing. Show dogs are
sometimes bathed on a daily basis, with no harm to their skin or
coat, as long as appropriate products are used.


Daily?!?!? That said, it definitely is dog dependent, which is why my
response to the OP was "as needed". Rudy has never had a bath, He's
been here almost a year. He's clean as a whistle. Franklin's last
bath, as well as Lucy's? Honestly can't remember, because it's been
that long. None smell doggy nor feel dirty. They swim, get hosed
off, brushed combed, etc. but shampoo? Not even yearly. Other dogs,
no way could they get away with that!

If I bathed my dog three times a year, my house would stink to high
heavens. And, while vinegar might be an acceptable substitute on
occasion, I wouldn't want to put something that acidic on my dog as
frequently as she would require it.


When I've used vinegar, it's been on a towel on a dog who can't get
wet due to surgery or such. A toweling with vinegar never reaches
their skin a whole lot, so that isn't a real concern.

You obviously need different dogs - self cleaning types! ;-D.
Actually, I think they'll all get a Christmas bath, just for the hell
of it.

--
Janet Boss
www.bestfriendsdogobedience.com
  #8  
Old November 28th 06, 12:20 AM posted to rec.pets.dogs.health
Lynne
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Posts: 2,609
Default Odor

on Tue, 28 Nov 2006 00:13:32 GMT, Janet B
wrote:

Daily?!?!? That said, it definitely is dog dependent, which is why my
response to the OP was "as needed". Rudy has never had a bath, He's
been here almost a year. He's clean as a whistle. Franklin's last
bath, as well as Lucy's? Honestly can't remember, because it's been
that long. None smell doggy nor feel dirty. They swim, get hosed
off, brushed combed, etc. but shampoo? Not even yearly. Other dogs,
no way could they get away with that!


Roxy never gets baths. She's had 2 max since we got her last year (and 1
only because my daughter wanted to do it for fun). We go tromping
through the mud in the woods and she can be covered in it, but it just
falls off her fur when it dries and she never smells bad. In fact, I
really like her smell.

Briar has a distinctive doggy odor and after just over a week since his
bath, he's already smelling really ripe. I've been brushing him daily to
no avail, but I figured out the problem this morning--he likes to roll in
****. I caught him doing it this morning... So I'll have to up the
pooper scooping frequency from once per day to SuperHyperVigilent.

--
Lynne

http://picasaweb.google.com/what.the.hell.is.it/
  #9  
Old November 28th 06, 12:39 AM posted to rec.pets.dogs.health
Shelly
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Posts: 3,103
Default Odor

Janet B wrote in
:

Daily?!?!?


My understanding from what I've read here over the years is that
they get frequent--even daily--baths while they're showing.
Obviously, they're not showing all the time.

That said, it definitely is dog dependent, which is
why my response to the OP was "as needed".


Yep. I thought your advice was fine.

Rudy has never had a bath, He's been here almost a year. He's
clean as a whistle. Franklin's last bath, as well as Lucy's?
Honestly can't remember, because it's been that long. None
smell doggy nor feel dirty. They swim, get hosed off, brushed
combed, etc. but shampoo? Not even yearly.


Elliott had about three baths in his life. Maybe four. He never,
ever got even a little whiffy. Northern/spitzy dogs tend to have
self-cleaning coats, like his.

Other dogs, no way could they get away with that!


That'd be Harriet. When she's clean, she smells like warm, clean
skin. It's quite pleasant. Monthly bathing is just about perfect
for her.

When I've used vinegar, it's been on a towel on a dog who can't
get wet due to surgery or such. A toweling with vinegar never
reaches their skin a whole lot, so that isn't a real concern.


That might be possible with a hairy dog, but not with a nekkid one.

You obviously need different dogs - self cleaning types! ;-D.


No way! I've had a self-cleaning dog, and the grooming was a pain
in my ass. I like the nearly hairless variety. Monthly baths for
a wash-n-go dog are no big deal.

Actually, I think they'll all get a Christmas bath, just for the
hell of it.


I dunno. If it ain't broke, why try to fix it?

--
Shelly
http://www.cat-sidh.net (the Mother Ship)
http://esther.cat-sidh.net (Letters to Esther)

You can owe nothing, if you give back its light to the sun.
-- Antonio Porchia, Voces
  #10  
Old November 28th 06, 02:31 AM posted to rec.pets.dogs.health
Suja
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Posts: 873
Default Odor


"Shelly" wrote in message:
Elliott had about three baths in his life. Maybe four. He never,
ever got even a little whiffy. Northern/spitzy dogs tend to have
self-cleaning coats, like his.


Before Khan developed whatever ails his skin ATM, he was like that. I
didn't need to bathe him for smell, although I did have to do that 'cause
his fur trapped so much dirt.

His skin condition has gone to heck (although it is better after starting
his Thyroid meds, it is not back to normal), and he does have a slight odor
now. The only thing the vet can think of is to bathe him more frequently.
Considering the trauma to him and me, I am just leaving it the hell alone.
It's not bothering him in any way that I can tell, and I don't have the
sharpest nose, so we live with it.

That'd be Harriet. When she's clean, she smells like warm, clean
skin. It's quite pleasant.


That's Pan. She smells pleasant all the way up to the point where she
decides to roll in goose poop or something dead. Then, it's bath time. In
fact, I can't think of a single bath she's had that wasn't preceded by some
such.

Suja


 




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