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FDA bans veg proteins from China and NUMBERS



 
 
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  #1  
Old May 1st 07, 12:06 PM posted to rec.pets.dogs.health
buglady
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Posts: 863
Default FDA bans veg proteins from China and NUMBERS

AT last the FDA takes action and admits the numbers of deaths they've
received. Seems the PetConnection database is similar. It's been a long
wait.......

http://www.fda.gov/ora/fiars/ora_import_ia9929.html
[..]
Wheat Gluten
Rice Gluten
Rice Protein
Rice Protein Concentrate
Corn Gluten
Corn Gluten Meal
Corn By-Products
Soy Protein
Soy Gluten
Proteins (includes amino acids and protein hydrosylates)
Mung Bean Protein

[..]
As of April 26, 2007, FDA had
received over 17,000 consumer complaints relating to this
outbreak, and those complaints included reports of approximately
1950 deaths of cats and 2200 deaths of dogs.
[..]


  #2  
Old May 1st 07, 01:23 PM posted to rec.pets.dogs.health
buglady
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Posts: 863
Default FDA bans veg proteins from China and NUMBERS


"buglady" wrote in message
ink.net...
http://www.fda.gov/ora/fiars/ora_import_ia9929.html


Proteins (includes amino acids and protein hydrosylates)


...........now here's something to think about.
Protein hydrosolates include: whey, milk, fish, all cereal grains or any
protein that is partially digested: http://www.karlloren.com/diet/p48.htm
Amino acids, hmmmmmmm, may be an attempt to be all inclusive. But it will
be interesting to see if any supplements go up in price........then you'll
know where they got their goods.

........Wonder if that house brand of yogurt with the whey protein will go up
in price?

............This FDA import notice was apparently posted on the same day as
the FDA press conference. For a discussion of the left hand apparently
being cut off from the right hand read PetConx blog entry on this issue.

.............Truly this is pretty all inclusive in scope, if you think about
all the human foods that are going to be affected. Perhaps the general
press will notice now? Expect to see people standing in the aisles
reading.

buglady
take out the dog before replying


  #3  
Old May 1st 07, 01:57 PM posted to rec.pets.dogs.health
Shelly
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Posts: 3,103
Default FDA bans veg proteins from China and NUMBERS

buglady wrote:
AT last the FDA takes action and admits the numbers of deaths they've
received. Seems the PetConnection database is similar. It's been a long
wait.......

http://www.fda.gov/ora/fiars/ora_import_ia9929.html
[..]


[snip big list o' glutens]

It amazes me that this stuff appears to *still* be available.

http://www.alibaba.com/manufacturer/14895176/Sell_Esb_Protein_Powder.html

Safe, non-poisonous, and without a bad reaction, eh? And what's
with the 160-300% protein?

(This has been discussed at PetCnx but I don't recall if it's been
mentioned here.)

--
Shelly
http://www.cat-sidh.net (the Mother Ship)
http://esther.cat-sidh.net (Letters to Esther)
  #4  
Old May 1st 07, 02:17 PM posted to rec.pets.dogs.health
buglady
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Posts: 863
Default FDA bans veg proteins from China and NUMBERS


"Sharon Too" wrote in message
...

I'd like to forward this to our local news stations. I'm just not certain
it's a total ban, or an advisory to the inspectors to detain shipments if
they have suspicion.

........SEND IT! Please!
..........Did you read the rest? Shippers don't like to have their stuff
held at the port. Ties up their ships, don't know if they'll have to
eventually take it back.......etc. So they're not saying they'll turn all
the ships around, but that they'll have to meet criteria they've set out,
which I doubt ANY Chinese manufacturer can meet at this minute, so it
amounts to the same thing. Here's the rest:

Districts may detain without physical examination, all Vegetable
protein products from China.

Appropriate screening criteria have been set.

If a firm, shipper or importer believes that their product should
not be subject to detention under this import alert they should
forward information supporting their position to FDA at the
following address:

Food and Drug Administration
Division of Import Operations and Policy (HFC-170)
5600 Fishers Lane, Room 12-36
Rockville, MD 20587

In order to adequately assess whether a manufacturer has the
appropriate controls and processes in place to ensure the quality
of the product being produced, the firm or shipper must provide
the following information:
1. Documentation showing that a minimum of five (5)
consecutive entries have been released by FDA based on
third party laboratory analyses using FDA recommended
methods and that all shipments did not contain the
presence of melamine and/or melamine analogs.

AND

2. Certificate, such as from AQSIQ, indicating that
an
inspection of the manufacturer was conducted and
adequate controls are in place. Information should
also include:

a. Copy of the inspectional reports and compliance
status of the manufacturer.

b. If products were sampled during the course of the
inspection, test results indicating that the
products are free of melamine and/or melamine
analog.


All requests for removal (exemption) from DWPE will be forwarded
by DIOP to CVM (HFV-230) or CFSAN (HFS-606) for
evaluation depending on the intended final use in animal
or human food.

.........so even if they're clean, they're going to have to sit around and
wait for approval........

buglady
take out the dog before replying



  #5  
Old May 1st 07, 02:25 PM posted to rec.pets.dogs.health
buglady
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Posts: 863
Default FDA bans veg proteins from China and NUMBERS


"Shelly" wrote in message
news
It amazes me that this stuff appears to *still* be available.


http://www.alibaba.com/manufacturer/14895176/Sell_Esb_Protein_Powder.html

Safe, non-poisonous, and without a bad reaction, eh? And what's
with the 160-300% protein?


........probably they added urea.

(This has been discussed at PetCnx but I don't recall if it's been
mentioned here.)


........No I haven't followed a lot of the wild theorizing over there. No
one listens anyway. I don't know how many times I've put out the Ochratoxin
fire. Someone's been going on about it forever. Now they're going on about
a Fusarium species, when they haven't the foggiest idea of what they're
talking about most of the time WRT fungi. I simply don't have the energy
any more! I looked at that stuff once, may check it out again, but it's a
protein powder.......it's that last bit in the advisory that covers ALL the
possibilities I think - amino acids and protein hyrosylates.

There's nothing evil about getting fungi to digest protein - there's a
traditional product in Europe that uses barley - tempeh is protein digested
by fungi. I think I axed the whole collection of urls I had collected. The
biggest problem when making any predigested stuff like this with fungi is
colonization by other fungal species which may produce mycotoxins. But, as
I keep saying, the MYCOTOXINS from whatever species are fairly well known
and there's just no way the scientists would NOT have tested for all of
them. It would be stupid not to. Ochratoxin A is a kidney killer. There's
a 10 minute test kit for it. That's all I got to say.

buglady
take ou tthe dog before replying


  #6  
Old May 1st 07, 02:41 PM posted to rec.pets.dogs.health
Sharon Too
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Posts: 664
Default FDA bans veg proteins from China and NUMBERS

ink.net...
AT last the FDA takes action and admits the numbers of deaths they've
received. Seems the PetConnection database is similar. It's been a long
wait.......


Is it an actual ban though?

GUIDANCE: Districts may detain without physical examination, all Vegetable
protein products from China.

The article is subject to refusal of admission

== MAY detain, and SUBJECT to... isn't exactly the same as an all out ban.

I'd like to forward this to our local news stations. I'm just not certain
it's a total ban, or an advisory to the inspectors to detain shipments if
they have suspicion.


  #7  
Old May 1st 07, 02:43 PM posted to rec.pets.dogs.health
Shelly
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Posts: 3,103
Default FDA bans veg proteins from China and NUMBERS

buglady wrote:

.......probably they added urea.


Hard to tell, because they don't exactly go out of their way to
explain the process or the product. How something can contain more
than 100% of anything is a mystery. I think what they mean is that,
when digested, it produces more protein than it contains, but I'm
not a chemist or biologist, so I'm not in any way qualified to even
hazard a guess.

.......No I haven't followed a lot of the wild theorizing over there.


The comments threads are long, and there is a lot of crazy to slog
through.

No
one listens anyway. I don't know how many times I've put out the Ochratoxin
fire. Someone's been going on about it forever. Now they're going on about
a Fusarium species, when they haven't the foggiest idea of what they're
talking about most of the time WRT fungi.


That discussion gave me a brain ache.

I simply don't have the energy any more!


And with good reason! You've been busy. Not even the multiple
bloggers at PetCnx can keep up with the updates.

I looked at that stuff once, may check it out again, but it's a
protein powder.......it's that last bit in the advisory that covers ALL the
possibilities I think - amino acids and protein hyrosylates.


Yep.

I just wonder if this particular protein powder is more than it
appears. It is described as incorporating non-protein nitrogen
(melamine?!) in order to reduce production costs of feed. And, it's
made by our good friends Anying Bio Tech.

There's nothing evil about getting fungi to digest protein - there's a
traditional product in Europe that uses barley - tempeh is protein digested
by fungi.


Yep.

And there's some of the hysteria I mentioned awhile back! Some of
those comments at PetCnx and elsewhere are beyond unhelpful, and
well into the realm of nutso.

I think I axed the whole collection of urls I had collected. The
biggest problem when making any predigested stuff like this with fungi is
colonization by other fungal species which may produce mycotoxins. But, as
I keep saying, the MYCOTOXINS from whatever species are fairly well known
and there's just no way the scientists would NOT have tested for all of
them.


I can't imagine that mycotoxins are to blame for this. It seems
more logical to me that melamine has been added to feed for
ages--and that it's more or less "safe" for some species--but now
cyanuric acid has also gotten into the mix, and that the combination
is what's causing problems. Maybe the cyanuric acid was in another
component of the feed, and that the heating process made it react
with the melamine? Maybe it's a problem with combining two
different pet foods, one containing melamine and one containing
cyanuric acid?

--
Shelly
http://www.cat-sidh.net (the Mother Ship)
http://esther.cat-sidh.net (Letters to Esther)
  #8  
Old May 1st 07, 03:15 PM posted to rec.pets.dogs.health
buglady
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 863
Default FDA bans veg proteins from China and NUMBERS

"Shelly" wrote in message
et...
It seems
more logical to me that melamine has been added to feed for
ages--and that it's more or less "safe" for some species-

.........yes for those with multiple stomachs - it's actually the bacteria
which digest their food for them and there are multiple species of bacteria
that eat melamine by successively cleaving off one amine group at a time.

One of my darker thoughts, as I was looking at melamine eating bacteria, is
that a couple of them are highly antibiotic resistant or can become so
easily. There was also one study in which they transferred the enzyme
producing ability to eat melamine to E. coli. Hmmmm....haven't heard any
official science people say bupkus about bacterial loads in these dead
animals. I just can't help wondering if it was a confounding factor.
Considering antibiotic use is also rampant in China, one can assume that
soil bacteria prevelant around any melamine producer would be largely those
that eat melamine and perhaps due to rampant use of antibiotics, may have
gained resistance. And as of yesterday, we know they dug up buried melamine
under a building!

-Maybe the cyanuric acid was in another
component of the feed, and that the heating process made it react
with the melamine? Maybe it's a problem with combining two
different pet foods, one containing melamine and one containing
cyanuric acid?

........I don't know and it's this that's driving me nuts! I've searched for
sci boards that might be discussing this logically, but haven't found any.
The INCHEM stuff mentioned that the crystals (think it was melamine) also
had phosphate and some other stuff in them. And let's not forget that there
was amiloride - a diuretic in the mix. Could be with 3 chemicals causing
massive peeing, the crystals just fell out in the kidneys all that much
faster like a supersaturated solution, which couldn't be overcome except for
IVs fluids at a crucial time BEFORE symptoms were noticed. Could be simple
physical chemistry. Especially for cats, who aren't normally driven to
drink even when thirsty.

buglady
take out the dog before replying


  #9  
Old May 1st 07, 03:16 PM posted to rec.pets.dogs.health
buglady
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 863
Default FDA bans veg proteins from China and NUMBERS


"buglady" wrote in message
link.net...

"Sharon Too" wrote in message
...

I'd like to forward this to our local news stations. I'm just not

certain
it's a total ban, or an advisory to the inspectors to detain shipments

if
they have suspicion.


Technically, you're right Sharon, our country has not banned these food
ingredients from China, just made it difficult to get them through
inspection.

buglady
take out the dog before replying


  #10  
Old May 1st 07, 04:57 PM posted to rec.pets.dogs.health
Lynne
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Posts: 2,609
Default FDA bans veg proteins from China and NUMBERS

on Tue, 01 May 2007 12:23:56 GMT, "buglady"
wrote:

Truly this is pretty all inclusive in scope, if you think about
all the human foods that are going to be affected. Perhaps the general
press will notice now? Expect to see people standing in the aisles
reading.


It was a top story on NBC Nightly News last night. Finally.

This is all so infuriating, and so heartbreaking.

--
Lynne


"We are strong enough to stand tall tearlessly
We are brave enough to bend to cry
And sad enough to know
We must laugh again"

~ Nikki Giovanni, 4/17/2007, Virginia Tech
 




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