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Ping Liisa
I know you understand coloration of dogs. How about horses?
I saw a white horse today (ok grey) I was not close enough to actually SEE the skin color. But the horse appeared a very clear color of white, with black socks to the knees and hocks. It had a white mane and tail. I never saw any color of horse like this before. If it had black socks, I would have expected a black mane and tail. There was none. This was not a bleached out buckskin. Can you explain this? |
#2
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Ping Liisa
diddy none wrote in :
I know you understand coloration of dogs. How about horses? I saw a white horse today (ok grey) I was not close enough to actually SEE the skin color. But the horse appeared a very clear color of white, with black socks to the knees and hocks. It had a white mane and tail. I never saw any color of horse like this before. If it had black socks, I would have expected a black mane and tail. There was none. This was not a bleached out buckskin. Yep, I know horse colors/patterns too :-) But I'm not sure if I can explain this properly. Greys do get pale in very different ways, and it is possible to have totally white mane and tail and still have colored lower legs - although solid white body white mane/tail + dark legs is a combination I'm not sure I've seen. What about non-spotted appaloosa? They can have nearly solid white body with darkish lower legs. Homozygous appaloosas normally have no or very few spots, and when other genes allow the "blanket" to cover all of the horse, the result can be nearly solid white. Such horses don't normaly have much dark on legs, just dark fetlocks and perhaps some dark on knees too. Or what about a grey with very pale base color, like palomino + grey? Naturally white mane + tail, and that grey gene can turn yellow palomino coat into dark grey before it goes white. Liisa |
#3
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Ping Liisa
Liisa Sarakontu spoke these words of wisdom in
6: diddy none wrote in : I know you understand coloration of dogs. How about horses? I saw a white horse today (ok grey) I was not close enough to actually SEE the skin color. But the horse appeared a very clear color of white, with black socks to the knees and hocks. It had a white mane and tail. I never saw any color of horse like this before. If it had black socks, I would have expected a black mane and tail. There was none. This was not a bleached out buckskin. Yep, I know horse colors/patterns too :-) But I'm not sure if I can explain this properly. Greys do get pale in very different ways, and it is possible to have totally white mane and tail and still have colored lower legs - although solid white body white mane/tail + dark legs is a combination I'm not sure I've seen. What about non-spotted appaloosa? They can have nearly solid white body with darkish lower legs. Homozygous appaloosas normally have no or very few spots, and when other genes allow the "blanket" to cover all of the horse, the result can be nearly solid white. Such horses don't normaly have much dark on legs, just dark fetlocks and perhaps some dark on knees too. Or what about a grey with very pale base color, like palomino + grey? Naturally white mane + tail, and that grey gene can turn yellow palomino coat into dark grey before it goes white. Liisa This horse, from a distance was as white as a sheet of paper. In fact, so white, it was striking. It was not a dirty white, or an off white, or a cream. It was VERY white, with full black stockings. I have never seen a palomino with black legs. These were not dark brown, or pale leggings, they appeared black. It was a striking looking horse, and I asked my husband to stop, but he would not/did not. In fact, i wanted to go to the house and ask about the horse. And my husband really wanted no part of that. It was a large horse, and I had wondered if perhaps it was a percheron-X (which may have explained the color) except I would have expected the body to change and gray, but the legs were still so dark, that I was simply curious. |
#4
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Ping Liisa
diddy none wrote in :
This horse, from a distance was as white as a sheet of paper. In fact, so white, it was striking. It was not a dirty white, or an off white, or a cream. It was VERY white, with full black stockings. No type of pinto (paint) is possible. Only frame overo pattern can give solid legs, all the other patterns give at least some white on legs, but frame overo never gives solid white body. There is always at least remnants of that "frame": color along backline and under neck. Any combination of frame and another pinto pattern would give partially or totally white legs. Only pattern with close-to-white body and very black legs is buckskin, which gives normally yellowish ("buckskin-colored") body but which can sometimes be so pale that it looks mostly white - but buckskins have always black or at least mixed dark/pale tail and mane. Grey gene sometimes fades tail and mane first without having much effect on rest of the body (except about always head). So a very pale buckskin going grey? Silver buckskin, which has silver and not black mane and tail in the first place, going grey? I have never seen a palomino with black legs. Palominos don't have black legs, but they can have "sooty" (clearly darker than rest of the coat) legs. And if grey gene is present, it most often turns the base color much darker than it would have been. A red chestnut going grey is normally born looking like any other chestnut foal, but it can look dark iron grey at the age of two years before starting to get paler. I have seen photos of such horse, which was registered as "grulla" although it was genetically chestnut grey without the dun/grulla gene. It was a striking looking horse, and I asked my husband to stop, but he would not/did not. Oh, stupid husband! Mine would behave just in the same way. Luckily it is me who does all the driving in our family and so if I want to stop, I do stop no matter what he says :-) In fact, i wanted to go to the house and ask about the horse. And my husband really wanted no part of that. It was a large horse, and I had wondered if perhaps it was a percheron-X (which may have explained the color) except I would have expected the body to change and gray, but the legs were still so dark, that I was simply curious. Most Percherons are indeed grey (and I think that black might be the most common base color), but they seem to go grey in a quite traditional way: They go through a very clearly dappled phase, tail and mane go white before body and legs don't stay solid dark very long. But the breed might have other types of going grey too. Here's a few-spot appaloosa, they can have whiter body than this horse has: http://www.aphcuk.org/images/Fewspot2.JPG Very interesting-looking few-spot appy filly, whose head most likely goes paler when it matures: http://www.dominofarm.com/Ziggaboo2005Foal.html This "white dun" Fjord Horse is genetically dun + buckskin. Tail and mane and renot solid white, and legs are not very dark, but this is anyway rather close to a "white horse with dark legs": http://www.bluebirdlane.com/whitedun.jpg Liisa |
#5
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Ping Liisa
Liisa Sarakontu spoke these words of wisdom in
16: http://www.bluebirdlane.com/whitedun.jpg This horse was as white as the appy filly, with solid black socks unlike the dun. But I "think" but was not sure, that there may have been a black dorsal stripe (lending credence to your DUN theory) But the mane and tail were clearly white. Which does not concur with the dorsal strip and Dun theory. It was without doubt, the most interesting colored horse i have ever seen. If I can find my way back there, I will take pictures |
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